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Post by texan on Aug 14, 2013 15:55:35 GMT
Its not that clear cut though, all goals have come on the overlap down our right and our defence's positioning has been atrocious and flat-footed. Going forward though is a different story, we're much more creative than them...problem is their defence is disciplined and does the basics well. They've had 5 chances and scored 4...Elliott Hewitt having a nightmare!
If anyone's interested too, new kit on display tonight...all red with white piping on the sleeves/collar, its an Umbro kit. Let's see if the seniors wear it tonight too though.
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Post by texan on Aug 14, 2013 16:01:15 GMT
Other problem is us bloody getting caught in posession as the defence plays it out, trying to be too fancy. Either that or Hewitt again pinging loose passes everywhere!
Lloyd Isgrove however...holy shit what a player, having a lot of joy down the left and tying the Finns up in knots...so its bizarre why they moved him to the right where he's been completely ineffective for the past 10 mins!
2nd half about to start...
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Post by hookd on Aug 14, 2013 16:13:11 GMT
This is embarrassing. Geraint Williams must be out of his depth. Great decision to ditch Flynn. I hope he did something atrocious to get sacked, otherwise the decision looks incredible stupid!
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Post by hookd on Aug 14, 2013 16:18:22 GMT
5 goals conceded at home to Finland. Not England, Germany or Brazil. Has to be a (lack of) coaching issue seriously
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Post by texan on Aug 14, 2013 16:56:09 GMT
5 goals conceded at home to Finland. Not England, Germany or Brazil. Has to be a (lack of) coaching issue seriously Yes I'd say...all 5 goals down to awful positioning/defending. Was a tactical and structural failure rather than a lack of skill.
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Post by hookd on Aug 14, 2013 17:28:07 GMT
I really do wonder whether a coach makes a difference with players turning their backs on Wales at this level, as it is not that typical is it? Were there any players who quite the U21s when Flynn was there (Hargreaves was forgotten about by a a previous coach before Flynn arrived and Rhys Williams quite after the U21s and would have been committed if Toshack used him vs Germany)? Is it possible the likes of Lloyd Jones and Jonathan Bond could have quite because of how amateurish the set up is? Look at Flynn - full of energy and optimism - that's what young players need; compare that to Williams! Obviously getting hammered by the likes of Finland at home is not going to help in our recruitment drive!
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Post by rushlegend on Aug 14, 2013 20:53:48 GMT
Quite simply, we are not good enough at any level, ROI could quite easily have scored 5 goals themselves tonight in the senior game. We are deluding ourselves thinking our crop are great players when quite frankly we are way not.
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Post by wirralwelsh on Aug 14, 2013 23:34:52 GMT
GK Connor Roberts 8 December 1992 (age 20) 1 0 Cheltenham Town GK Danny Ward 22 June 1993 (age 20) 1 0 Liverpool DF Daniel Alfei* 23 February 1992 (age 21) 12 2 Wrexham (loan) DF Kieron Freeman 21 March 1992 (age 21) 9 0 Derby County DF Jonathan Meades 2 March 1992 (age 21) 3 0 A.F.C. Wimbledon (loan) DF Scott Tancock 29 October 1992 (age 20) 1 0 Swansea City DF Joe Walsh 13 May 1992 (age 21) 2 0 Crawley Town DF George Ray 13 December 1993 (age 19) 0 0 Crewe Alexandra DF Alex Nicholson 1 February 1994 (age 19) 0 0 Newcastle United MF Billy Bodin 24 March 1992 (age 21) 15 2 Torquay United MF Lee Evans* 24 July 1994 (age 19) 0 0 Wolverhampton Wanderers MF Elliott Hewitt* 30 May 1994 (age 19) 6 0 Ipswich Town MF Emyr Huws 30 September 1993 (age 19) 2 0 Manchester City MF Lloyd Isgrove* 12 January 1993 (age 20) 1 0 Southampton MF Tom Lawrence 13 January 1994 (age 19) 1 0 Manchester United MF Lee Lucas 19 May 1992 (age 21) 12 1 Swansea City MF Louis Thompson 19 December 1994 (age 18) 0 0 Swindon Town MF Ellis Harrison 29 January 1994 (age 19) 0 0 Bristol Rovers FW Wes Burns 28 October 1995 (age 17) 1 1 Bristol City FW Jake Cassidy 9 February 1993 (age 20) 4 0 Wolverhampton Wanderers FW Chris Dawson* 2 September 1994 (age 18) 1 0 Leeds United FW Robert Ogleby 5 January 1992 (age 21) 7 1 Wrexham FW Theo Wharton 15 November 1994 (age 18) 0 0 Cardiff City According to wiki, thats the last squad that was picked last season. Fair play, its a strong looking squad, and you could add Declan John (Cardiff) to that. What about Dummett (Newcastle) too? Sorry to not be able to see the strength in that squad but where exactly is it? The star turn is a player who performed with consistent mediocrity in the english bottom league last season, nobody has appeared in a premiership first team squad and they have many 10 championship appearances between them. Where's the Bales , Ramseys or even Ledleys there? These kids are playing reserve team football week in week out for the most part i, s it any wonder they come apart when coming up against players playing at first team level every week (albeit in a fairly shit league)? You can throw all the 'structure' you like at them they are still going to ship a lot of goals
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Post by flynnfan on Aug 15, 2013 11:13:32 GMT
Huws is highly rated at Man City Isgrove featured regularly pre-seasosn for Southampton Cassidy scored about 12 goals last season for Tranmere Lee Evans has had a great start at Wolves Hewitt and Freeman championship regulars sofar this season..
but maybe I was wrong about their potential quality. Last night's result sadly suggests so...
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Post by squatter1 on Aug 15, 2013 11:17:41 GMT
GK Connor Roberts 8 December 1992 (age 20) 1 0 Cheltenham Town GK Danny Ward 22 June 1993 (age 20) 1 0 Liverpool DF Daniel Alfei* 23 February 1992 (age 21) 12 2 Wrexham (loan) DF Kieron Freeman 21 March 1992 (age 21) 9 0 Derby County DF Jonathan Meades 2 March 1992 (age 21) 3 0 A.F.C. Wimbledon (loan) DF Scott Tancock 29 October 1992 (age 20) 1 0 Swansea City DF Joe Walsh 13 May 1992 (age 21) 2 0 Crawley Town DF George Ray 13 December 1993 (age 19) 0 0 Crewe Alexandra DF Alex Nicholson 1 February 1994 (age 19) 0 0 Newcastle United MF Billy Bodin 24 March 1992 (age 21) 15 2 Torquay United MF Lee Evans* 24 July 1994 (age 19) 0 0 Wolverhampton Wanderers MF Elliott Hewitt* 30 May 1994 (age 19) 6 0 Ipswich Town MF Emyr Huws 30 September 1993 (age 19) 2 0 Manchester City MF Lloyd Isgrove* 12 January 1993 (age 20) 1 0 Southampton MF Tom Lawrence 13 January 1994 (age 19) 1 0 Manchester United MF Lee Lucas 19 May 1992 (age 21) 12 1 Swansea City MF Louis Thompson 19 December 1994 (age 18) 0 0 Swindon Town MF Ellis Harrison 29 January 1994 (age 19) 0 0 Bristol Rovers FW Wes Burns 28 October 1995 (age 17) 1 1 Bristol City FW Jake Cassidy 9 February 1993 (age 20) 4 0 Wolverhampton Wanderers FW Chris Dawson* 2 September 1994 (age 18) 1 0 Leeds United FW Robert Ogleby 5 January 1992 (age 21) 7 1 Wrexham FW Theo Wharton 15 November 1994 (age 18) 0 0 Cardiff City According to wiki, thats the last squad that was picked last season. Fair play, its a strong looking squad, and you could add Declan John (Cardiff) to that. What about Dummett (Newcastle) too? Sorry to not be able to see the strength in that squad but where exactly is it? The star turn is a player who performed with consistent mediocrity in the english bottom league last season, nobody has appeared in a premiership first team squad and they have many 10 championship appearances between them. Where's the Bales , Ramseys or even Ledleys there? These kids are playing reserve team football week in week out for the most part i, s it any wonder they come apart when coming up against players playing at first team level every week (albeit in a fairly shit league)? You can throw all the 'structure' you like at them they are still going to ship a lot of goals This. Sadly.
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Post by squatter1 on Aug 15, 2013 11:33:56 GMT
What position did Isgrove play by the way?
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Post by texan on Aug 15, 2013 11:35:51 GMT
What position did Isgrove play by the way? Outside on left mostly.
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Post by steelrod on Aug 15, 2013 11:57:44 GMT
Huws is highly rated at Man City Isgrove featured regularly pre-seasosn for Southampton Cassidy scored about 12 goals last season for Tranmere Lee Evans has had a great start at Wolves Hewitt and Freeman championship regulars sofar this season.. but maybe I was wrong about their potential quality. Last night's result sadly suggests so... Yes, 1-5 can't be classed as anything other than a hiding. Yet I thought Wales played some good football in spells, particularly early in the second half. Finland played a direct fast game, moved the ball quickly and caught out a very static Wales defence three times with the same move to score. The keeper didn't play particularly well and the right full back (Nicholls? Is that the Ipswich lad?)unfortunately had one of those games he won't want to remember. Wales had 5 good chances where they should have scored, but were let down by some awful finishing and the Finnish keeper was also very good. Wales also need to move the ball quicker. Huws played well in a midfield otherwise lacking in pace and craft, and it would have been a different story if Johnny Williams had played alongside him I also thought the skipper (was that Isgrove?) did ok. Perhaps I am being over optimistic but I thought it was one of those games when 2/3 players just had complete "mares." And does anybody remember how bad England U21's were back in the summer?
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Post by squatter1 on Aug 15, 2013 12:18:14 GMT
What position did Isgrove play by the way? Outside on left mostly. Like left midfield? Left wing? Left back?
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Post by texan on Aug 15, 2013 12:21:50 GMT
Forward player, left wing
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Post by squatter1 on Aug 15, 2013 12:33:21 GMT
That's good news if he played well there. Let's see how he does at Southampton this year - that's a position we could seriously do with some good options in.
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Post by texan on Aug 15, 2013 12:36:53 GMT
That scoreline came about because of one main reason...Elliott Hewitt at right back! I can't emphasise to you how awful a game this lad had. He may as well have been on the sidelines having a cuppa and a fag the use he was to the team. EVERY SINGLE TIME they ran at him he was on his heels and got turned around, constantly running back towards his own goal. The rest of the defence was always having to run over to help him out, leaving gaps down the middle for Finnish runners. So bad was he that three of the four 1st half goals were entirely his fault. For the third, even Freeman (at left-back) had run over to cover!! Freeman then had a soft header back to Ward but put no pace or power on it, it bounced into no-man's land in the box where Yaghoubi was in acres of space and slotted past a half-arsed challenge by Ward (who didn't impress either!). Basically our defensive organisation overall was a bloody mess, Ward was screaming out commanding but mixed messages and the backs were statues, with both centre halves having to do the work of four players.
Going forward however was a different story, I don't agree the midfield lacked craft, Isgrove was superb in both halves (blonde number 11, Walsh was captain I think) constantly running at (and going past) his markers to put a ball in, as was Dawson and Burns in the second half...supremely gifted players who frightened the life out of the Finns and got behind them on a couple of occasions, they simply couldn't cope with their pace/trickery. We carved out a number of opportunites and actually fluffed two open goals from a couple yards out, the finishing certainly could have been better.
Isgrove, Huws and Dawson are ones to watch closely this season, with Cassidy, Lawrence and Burns also showing a lot of talent and nous.
Finland's defending was sublime however, always marking two-on-one, whilst their 'keeper had a stunning game, commanding his box and snuffing out everything we threw towards the box. Especially in the 2nd half where we had to play through 8-9 bodies sat on the edge of their own box.
Basically Hewitt shot us in the foot and we couldn't recover.
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Post by squatter1 on Aug 15, 2013 12:50:53 GMT
"Isgrove, Huws and Dawson are ones to watch closely this season"
Good shout - let's hope at least two of these three have good seasons of 1st team football this year and are in the senior squad come the next qualifiers.
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Post by toshfan on Aug 15, 2013 14:22:53 GMT
I still hold the view that Joniesta should have started this game. I really appreciate the update from Texan but will be looking out for comment from Geraint Williams.
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Post by texan on Aug 15, 2013 14:33:37 GMT
I still hold the view that Joniesta should have started this game. I really appreciate the update from Texan but will be looking out for comment from Geraint Williams. Considering the U21's match was a qualifier yes, I'd have to agree that he should have been up north rather than with the full squad. As the assistant coach responsible for defence, I'd like to hear Rob Page comment on last night myself...something along the lines of "sorry" would be a start, preferably preceeded by a question along the lines of "what the f*ck have you been teaching them?!".
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Post by flynnfan on Aug 15, 2013 20:26:11 GMT
I still hold the view that Joniesta should have started this game. I really appreciate the update from Texan but will be looking out for comment from Geraint Williams. Yeah, I'm still awaiting some sort of explanation for that result from the manager...
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Post by llannerch on Aug 15, 2013 21:09:19 GMT
I'm pretty sure the coaches didn't tell Elliott Hewitt to play like a bum
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2013 22:45:43 GMT
I still hold the view that Joniesta should have started this game. I really appreciate the update from Texan but will be looking out for comment from Geraint Williams. Yeah, I'm still awaiting some sort of explanation for that result from the manager... Watch the highlights on BBC Iplayer, Geraint Williams is interviewed after the game! short interview just says he didn't see it coming and that it was unacceptable etc. Lee Evans tweeted that he was gutted not to have been given a chance to play! Jake Cassidy also tweeted saying he's always extremely proud to represent his country win lose or draw!
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Post by toshfan on Aug 16, 2013 9:24:50 GMT
Yeah, I'm still awaiting some sort of explanation for that result from the manager... Watch the highlights on BBC Iplayer, Geraint Williams is interviewed after the game! short interview just says he didn't see it coming and that it was unacceptable etc. Lee Evans tweeted that he was gutted not to have been given a chance to play! Jake Cassidy also tweeted saying he's always extremely proud to represent his country win lose or draw! I saw that also. Will check the FAW site later to see if anything further. Almost your 1000th post. Congratulations!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2013 11:35:48 GMT
Watch the highlights on BBC Iplayer, Geraint Williams is interviewed after the game! short interview just says he didn't see it coming and that it was unacceptable etc. Lee Evans tweeted that he was gutted not to have been given a chance to play! Jake Cassidy also tweeted saying he's always extremely proud to represent his country win lose or draw! I saw that also. Will check the FAW site later to see if anything further. Almost your 1000th post. Congratulations! Haha and it is...diolch! I wonder why some players weren't included like Lloyd Jones and Declan John, clubs didn't want them there maybe.
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Post by flynnfan on Aug 16, 2013 12:17:59 GMT
short interview just says he didn't see it coming and that it was unacceptable etc. ------------------ Well, that's good at least. Jimmy Shoulder would have probably talked up that result 'we only lost by 4 goals to an excellent side' etc
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Post by scoop76 on Sept 5, 2013 18:15:48 GMT
Finland U21 won 1-0 in Lithuania this evening to go above Lithuania at the top of the group. Finland now look the most likely to challenge England at the top of the group. Wales U21 really need 10 or 12 points from the next 4 games (San Marino away, Moldova away, Lithuania home, San Marino home) to stay in contention. Finland host England on Monday.
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Post by flynnfan on Oct 18, 2013 12:39:36 GMT
Next game is England away on March 5th. We need to get something to stay in contention. The seniors might have a friendly, but considering how strong England will be, and how high profile this game will be (for an u21 fixture), I'm wondering if Geraint Williams should call up his strongest possible players?
Certainly Declan John, Harry Wilson and Lloyd Isgrove should be in there. But should Joniesta play this game for the u21s too? and then there's Ben Davies? even Adam Matthews?
I imagine wherever its played in England there'll be decnt Welsh support there. I was at Villa Park in 2008- the atmosphere in the Wales end was amazing. It would be great if the Barry Horns could make this game too.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2013 13:59:19 GMT
I was at Villa Park in 2008- the atmosphere in the Wales end was amazing. I wish I had went Flynny! Ramsey's telepathy with Church was incredible. If it's in Madjeski if not Villa Park I shall look to go in March if there's not alternative of 1st side.
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Post by texan on Oct 18, 2013 14:19:34 GMT
I watched that with a few mates in the 'al-fresco' bit of the Old Arcade in Cardiff. Amazing just how many people walking by asked us "what's going on?"...by the end there were about 30 passers-by standing over us screaming along for Wales with us, piss funny!
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