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Post by alarch on Oct 1, 2020 22:38:04 GMT
Arghhhh.......just looked on Twitter. I like how he's played one senior game for them (not counting that one 4 years ago) and he's already being told to fuck off. He was facing an impossible task tonight. Imagine having to desperately impress a club that have shown absolutely no interest in you over the past 5 years. Poor player management, and deserves better. Liverpool have pissed him around too much. May well be true, but putting aside all the hot air, isn't the essential truth that Harry Wilson isn't at the required level for Liverpool? I don't think so. In fact I'm not sure he's good enough for a regular starting place in the Cymru team. He's still youngish mind, so plenty of time for him to prove me wrong. |
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Post by dai on Oct 1, 2020 22:46:43 GMT
Arghhhh.......just looked on Twitter. I like how he's played one senior game for them (not counting that one 4 years ago) and he's already being told to fuck off. He was facing an impossible task tonight. Imagine having to desperately impress a club that have shown absolutely no interest in you over the past 5 years. Poor player management, and deserves better. Liverpool have pissed him around too much. May well be true, but putting aside all the hot air, isn't the essential truth that Harry Wilson isn't at the required level for Liverpool? I don't think so. In fact I'm not sure he's good enough for a regular starting place in the Cymru team. He's still youngish mind, so plenty of time for him to prove me wrong. Yeah, I commented somewhere else that Wilson isn't anywhere near a starter for us - I've said many a times that J Williams is a much better alternative in that 10 role that they both seem to play. It says a lot that a League 1 player is head and shoulders above him. I agree that he clearly hasn't been at a good enough level for Liverpool, and not for a few years now. So it begs the question why have Liverpool dragged his contract out, sending him on loans here and there. He should've left 2+ years ago to establish himself somewhere else. |
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Post by walesgolfmadrid on Oct 1, 2020 22:52:13 GMT
May well be true, but putting aside all the hot air, isn't the essential truth that Harry Wilson isn't at the required level for Liverpool? I don't think so. In fact I'm not sure he's good enough for a regular starting place in the Cymru team. He's still youngish mind, so plenty of time for him to prove me wrong. Yeah, I commented somewhere else that Wilson isn't anywhere near a starter for us - I've said many a times that J Williams is a much better alternative in that 10 role that they both seem to play. It says a lot that a League 1 player is head and shoulders above him. I agree that he clearly hasn't been at a good enough level for Liverpool, and not for a few years now. So it begs the question why have Liverpool dragged his contract out, sending him on loans here and there. He should've left 2+ years ago to establish himself somewhere else. Jonny isn't head and shoulders above him. As for he should have left two years ago, to do what play games? He's played plenty of games in his loan spells (84 games in the last 2 seasons) and had more than his fair share of opportunities at both clubs. What would a permanent move have done in terms of opportunities that his loan moves didn't? He's still got the opportunity to leave permanently this summer, with plenty of first team experience behind him, and Burnley are very much in for him (they've bid £12 million plus £4 million add-ons, which Liverpool have turned down). |
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Post by dai on Oct 1, 2020 22:56:09 GMT
Yeah, I commented somewhere else that Wilson isn't anywhere near a starter for us - I've said many a times that J Williams is a much better alternative in that 10 role that they both seem to play. It says a lot that a League 1 player is head and shoulders above him. I agree that he clearly hasn't been at a good enough level for Liverpool, and not for a few years now. So it begs the question why have Liverpool dragged his contract out, sending him on loans here and there. He should've left 2+ years ago to establish himself somewhere else.
As for he should have left two years ago, to do what play games? He's played plenty of games in his loan spells (84 games in the last 2 seasons) and had more than his fair share of opportunities at both clubs. What would a permanent move have done in terms of opportunities that his loan moves didn't? He's still got the opportunity to leave permanently this summer, with plenty of first team experience behind him, and Burnley are very much in for him (they've bid £12 million plus £4 million add-ons, which Liverpool have turned down). I'd say he is. Williams often lifts the team, especially when brought on as a sub. He provides the go-forward that not many of our players can to be honest, and never lets a game pass him by like Wilson does. Second point, I would argue a permanent move would have given him more mental stability, which in turn would have given him a better platform to improve his all round game. I think loan's are good in the short term, but to be continuously sent on loan I feel is detrimental to a players' development. |
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Post by iot on Oct 1, 2020 22:59:17 GMT
May well be true, but putting aside all the hot air, isn't the essential truth that Harry Wilson isn't at the required level for Liverpool? I don't think so. In fact I'm not sure he's good enough for a regular starting place in the Cymru team. He's still youngish mind, so plenty of time for him to prove me wrong. Yeah, I commented somewhere else that Wilson isn't anywhere near a starter for us - I've said many a times that J Williams is a much better alternative in that 10 role that they both seem to play. It says a lot that a League 1 player is head and shoulders above him. I agree that he clearly hasn't been at a good enough level for Liverpool, and not for a few years now. So it begs the question why have Liverpool dragged his contract out, sending him on loans here and there. He should've left 2+ years ago to establish himself somewhere else. Possibly, but we don't really know the ins and outs of it. He went on a loan spell to crewe when he was a scrawny 19 year old and couldn't get a game. So lpool decided his development would be better with their u23s until he filled out a bit more. He then went to hull for half a season on loan where he had a great spell, but obviously not enough to push for a place in the liverpool side. So he was sent to derby for another loan spell which was generally successful, if not a little hot and cold. So the next logical step was a loan spell to see what he could do in the prem, which he did last season and was disappointing. So I'm not sure liverpool's that much to blame. I think they're just kicking themselves, because he was valued at around £20m before his bournemouth spell, but with that poor season and the impact of covid, his value seems to have dropped. Burnley are documented to have table a bid of 12m + another 4m in add ons. I think that's more than a fair offer which liverppol should accept, but they're still holding out for 20m which i do think is wrong. |
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Post by dai on Oct 1, 2020 23:01:57 GMT
I agree, I think 20million is far too much. I would argue that 12m+4m add ons is generous to be honest.
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Post by richierich333 on Oct 2, 2020 7:38:06 GMT
Two points for me:
1. I honestly don't think Liverpool have mismanaged him and he needs to take some responsibility for not getting involved enough in games.
2. Liverpool are asking too much at the moment and I think 10-15m is a fair price.
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Post by TheWelshWay on Oct 2, 2020 9:08:34 GMT
Given the goals he scored for Derby. if he was there permanently, i believe he would be given some leeway for his performances as he was one of their top scorers. on loan, clubs will evaluate every year and go - he's a bit of a luxury. That said, for a bottom table prem team his goals could keep them up. Bournemouth could rue not starting him much post Covid (likely as they wanted to give a chance to their own non loan players to keep them up)
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Post by allezlesrouges on Oct 2, 2020 10:16:57 GMT
My opinion is that his biggest conundrum is what his strongest position is. He doesn't seem to be a winger or a creative no.10. He can score goals but isn't a prolific scorer yet. He's now being tried in midfield. I'd love to see him turn into a proper goal scorer - it's the one position I can see him becoming a top player in
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Post by TheWelshWay on Oct 2, 2020 10:33:01 GMT
I see him a bit like Shaqiri - plays a lot on the right wing, albeit not what you'd think about as a winger. Not a deep lying midfielder. Can play No.10 but isn’t creative enough from there - but can score some amazing goals when given space. Teams won't give him that free role as they're now focusing more on team systems.
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Post by nwcherries on Oct 2, 2020 11:00:59 GMT
Sorry to say but one thing we don’t rue about last season is not starting Wilson enough. He might’ve got the odd finish out of every 5 anonymous performances but I never felt as though he was up for the battle tbh. Needs a permanent move to a club that’ll play to his strengths.
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Post by TheWelshWay on Oct 2, 2020 11:09:47 GMT
Sorry to say but one thing we don’t rue about last season is not starting Wilson enough. He might’ve got the odd finish out of every 5 anonymous performances but I never felt as though he was up for the battle tbh. Needs a permanent move to a club that’ll play to his strengths. Said you 'could have', we don't know what would have happened if HW played more for you. Only played 90 mins 3 times. He has been anonymous for us many times, but scored a vital goal v Ireland which won the game. There can be no debate that he can score goals. Performances and results are two different things, and the latter can keep teams up.
Conversly, he could have been awful and not scored anything.  |
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Post by nwcherries on Oct 2, 2020 11:17:57 GMT
Sorry to say but one thing we don’t rue about last season is not starting Wilson enough. He might’ve got the odd finish out of every 5 anonymous performances but I never felt as though he was up for the battle tbh. Needs a permanent move to a club that’ll play to his strengths. Said you 'could have', we don't know what would have happened if HW played more for you. Only played 90 mins 3 times. He has been anonymous for us many times, but scored a vital goal v Ireland which won the game. There can be no debate that he can score goals. Performances and results are two different things, and the latter can keep teams up.
Conversly, he could have been awful and not scored anything. You are technically correct I suppose. Unfortunately for Harry, Brooks is twice the player he is so was never going to get much of a look-in once he returned. We were so bad and got so many awful thrashings post lockdown that I don’t think even 4 or 5 Wilson goals would have helped lol. We should’ve sent him to Sheffield as an undercover agent to switch on Hawkeye. |
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Post by dai on Oct 2, 2020 15:20:08 GMT
Burnley have dropped their interest in Wilson, which is not surprising.
Hard to see where he goes tbh. He's no way worth 20million, and is arguably Championship standard - but who will pay for him!?
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Post by gimli on Oct 2, 2020 15:20:56 GMT
Apparently Burnley have had a £16m bid for Harry rejected, and have have now pulled out of talks because Liverpool are demanding £20m. Can't see anyone paying £20m for him, and people speculating that he'll be kept as cover now that Shaqiri is likely to leave. He really should ask to leave the club as he'll never be more than a reserve for them.
Sometimes it seems that our players are too nice/professional, accommodating their clubs' wishes at the expense of their own careers. Shame that players like Wilson and Danny Ward have wasted so much time at clubs that have no interest in playing them but are happy to have them rotting in the reserves, when they could have demanded transfers earlier in their careers and been regulars at other clubs.
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Post by dai on Oct 2, 2020 15:31:15 GMT
Apparently Burnley have had a £16m bid for Harry rejected, and have have now pulled out of talks because Liverpool are demanding £20m. Can't see anyone paying £20m for him, and people speculating that he'll be kept as cover now that Shaqiri is likely to leave. He really should ask to leave the club as he'll never be more than a reserve for them. Sometimes it seems that our players are too nice/professional, accommodating their clubs' wishes at the expense of their own careers. Shame that players like Wilson and Danny Ward have wasted so much time at clubs that have no interest in playing them but are happy to have them rotting in the reserves, when they could have demanded transfers earlier in their careers and been regulars at other clubs. Really? I thought the bid was 12m and Liverpool wanted 15m. If he's kept as cover he's literally not going to get any gametime, what with Liverpool out of the cup. |
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Post by gimli on Oct 2, 2020 16:04:50 GMT
Apparently Burnley have had a £16m bid for Harry rejected, and have have now pulled out of talks because Liverpool are demanding £20m. Can't see anyone paying £20m for him, and people speculating that he'll be kept as cover now that Shaqiri is likely to leave. He really should ask to leave the club as he'll never be more than a reserve for them. Sometimes it seems that our players are too nice/professional, accommodating their clubs' wishes at the expense of their own careers. Shame that players like Wilson and Danny Ward have wasted so much time at clubs that have no interest in playing them but are happy to have them rotting in the reserves, when they could have demanded transfers earlier in their careers and been regulars at other clubs. Really? I thought the bid was 12m and Liverpool wanted 15m. If he's kept as cover he's literally not going to get any gametime, what with Liverpool out of the cup. I think they bid £12m rising to £15m, but Liverpool want £15m rising to £20m. |
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Post by dai on Oct 5, 2020 15:43:06 GMT
Worrying times for Wilson. Not looking likely to move, so when will he actually play a club game next?
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Post by jbt95 on Oct 5, 2020 16:11:38 GMT
Worrying times for Wilson. Not looking likely to move, so when will he actually play a club game next? Today is not transfer deadline day really, just trading with teams abroad with players going to England. Players can move between the PL/EFL until a week Friday 16th at 5pm BST. |
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Post by dai on Oct 5, 2020 16:12:59 GMT
Worrying times for Wilson. Not looking likely to move, so when will he actually play a club game next? Today is not transfer deadline day really, just trading with teams abroad with players going to England. Players can move between the PL/EFL until a week Friday 16th at 5pm BST. Yeah I know, but the lack of interest is worrying. Has he been linked with any other club apart from Burnley? Liverpool are also overpricing him which doesn't help. |
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Post by impeachabull on Oct 5, 2020 16:14:09 GMT
Worrying times for Wilson. Not looking likely to move, so when will he actually play a club game next? Today is not transfer deadline day really, just trading with teams abroad with players going to England. Players can move between the PL/EFL until a week Friday 16th at 5pm BST. Is that the case for PL to PL transfers? |
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Post by jbt95 on Oct 5, 2020 19:03:51 GMT
Today is not transfer deadline day really, just trading with teams abroad with players going to England. Players can move between the PL/EFL until a week Friday 16th at 5pm BST. Is that the case for PL to PL transfers? Believe so |
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Post by dai on Oct 5, 2020 19:04:34 GMT
Is that the case for PL to PL transfers? Believe so Yeah, domestic transfer deadline is extended to the 16th. I guess it gives Wilson the international games to attract interest - if he plays of course. |
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Post by jbt95 on Oct 5, 2020 19:05:38 GMT
Yeah, domestic transfer deadline is extended to the 16th. I guess it gives Wilson the international games to attract interest - if he plays of course. Course he will play. |
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Post by manulike on Oct 5, 2020 19:06:55 GMT
Yeah, domestic transfer deadline is extended to the 16th. I guess it gives Wilson the international games to attract interest - if he plays of course. Course he will play. And score |
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Post by impeachabull on Oct 5, 2020 19:07:35 GMT
I think it's only EFL to PL (or vice versa) though, and I'm not sure any Championship team would come anywhere near Liverpool's valuation. See this: "There is a second deadline for domestic transfers in England, 5pm on Friday 16 October. This will be for loans or permanent transfers between Premier League and EFL clubs. No transfers can take place between Premier League clubs or with foreign clubs in this additional period." |
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Post by walesgolfmadrid on Oct 5, 2020 19:15:28 GMT
I think there'll be quite a few players who'll end up having to go on loan to the Championship when the window shuts if nothing's sorted before then. There's not great blood there with him and Bournemouth, but Watford look like they might lose Sarr and Deulofeu and he could perhaps to go to someone like that.
They might not think it's ideal, but they might have to loan him him to a side towards the top of the Championship, it'd be better for him and for Liverpool then him just playing for the U23's for the season.
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Post by gogdownsouth on Oct 7, 2020 14:59:57 GMT
Reckon he will stay till January then someone will be in for him. Very much doubt he will get much (if any) club football between now and then
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Post by jbt95 on Oct 7, 2020 16:57:24 GMT
Reckon he will stay till January then someone will be in for him. Very much doubt he will get much (if any) club football between now and then That isn't the end of the world if it is true. Not long till then really. |
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Post by gogdownsouth on Oct 8, 2020 10:20:38 GMT
Reckon he will stay till January then someone will be in for him. Very much doubt he will get much (if any) club football between now and then That isn't the end of the world if it is true. Not long till then really. Exactly, I think why Liverpool probably held off selling him to get the right price in January, I mean it opens again in 8 weeks or so |
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