Wes Burns

[rob]

Wes Burns is a very promising winger/forward but surely with our goal shy attack Tom Bradshaw would have been a better option.Burns has only been a sub for Bristol City this season whilst Bradshaw has been a prolific scorer since signing for Walsall last year.

[dai]

I really don't understand this at all. What does Bradshaw need to do to earn a call up?

Has he turned us down then? Has something happened between him and Coleman?

Just bizarre he's that our most prolific goalscorer atm (granted, only league 1), but yet, every other welsh tom, dick and harry get a look in.

[cadno]

Burns has had a good amount of game time at Bristol this season.

He's played on the wing for them so he's a like-for-like replacement for Cotts, but I am surprised at the call up as he's a key player for our u21s.

Bradshaw a little bit hard done by..

[toshfan]

For me the key question is whether any of the media have asked our manager about Bradshaw? Whatever the rights and wrongs, maybe the FAW decision not to consider him for selection is still in place?

What Burns brings to the table is pace.

[ohjoeyjoey]

Just checked Burns stats for the season. 8 appearances all as a sub, 0 goals.

Bradshaw must be really aggrieved. I'm stunned. We are crying out for a goal scorer. Why not pick the highest scoring welsh player this season in the squad at least

[welshiron]

What is all the fuss about the guy has scored goals in league 1 and no club from a higher league came in for him in the transfer window so that tells you plenty.

Also, I don't think he can feel aggrieved in anyway after rejecting the chance to play for the U21s.

Surprised Burns has been called up as the U21s need him and they have to trim the squad by 2 players anyway

[porthcawlred]

I don't know too much about Bradshaw so I don't feel I can comment on him, but I'm assuming Burns is being reward for his efforts in the Wales under 21s games. He was one of the stand out players against Luxembourg in my opinion. As some said, with a big game for the under 21s this time around its strange to take their better players for now, and there are other players that may have deserved a chance first, but Burns deserves something for his international efforts

[sleepy]

Oct 6, 2015 12:44:47 GMT toshfan said:

For me the key question is whether any of the media have asked our manager about Bradshaw?

Agree with this, spot on. Tosh - aren't you twitter mates with Rob Phillips, could you ask him to ask perhaps. I'll 2nd it on twitter if you do so.

[ohjoeyjoey]

Stats from the start of last season 14/15 up till today

Bradshaw has scored 25 goals in 40 appearances (league 1)

Burns 5 in 31 (all goals scored on loan in league 2)

Church 4 in 26 (championship)

Kanu 4 in 45 (championship)

Lawrence 2 in 12 (championship)

Yes Bradshaw is playing at a lower level at the moment, but Jesus Christ his goal scoring record over this and last season is on another planet to anyone else (Bale obviously excluded).

[welshiron]

There is a reason he is playing in league 1

Look at Jordan Rhodes bangs in goals for fun in the championship but has never been signed by an EPL club and doesn't get a look in for Scotland.

I hope we are passed picking players from the lower leagues especially players whose commitment is in doubt.

[ohjoeyjoey]

Look at David Healy. Didn't make it at the top level, yet scored shed loads at international level. Unless we try Bradshaw, we will never know. There really isn't anything to lose by picking him, but maybe, just maybe we will find a gem who can score goals for us.

[richierich333]

Oct 6, 2015 13:57:47 GMT ohjoeyjoey said:

Look at David Healy. Didn't make it at the top level, yet scored shed loads at international level. Unless we try Bradshaw, we will never know. There really isn't anything to lose by picking him, but maybe, just maybe we will find a gem who can score goals for us.

I think he did play prem football for a bit though.  Also most of his goals were in the championship which is a LOT better than League 1

[cadno]

Oct 6, 2015 13:30:06 GMT welshiron said:

There is a reason he is playing in league 1

Look at Jordan Rhodes bangs in goals for fun in the championship but has never been signed by an EPL club and doesn't get a look in for Scotland.

I hope we are passed picking players from the lower leagues especially players whose commitment is in doubt.

Do they play Ross McCormack much?

[welwyn]

I think on this occasion it is a winger for a winger

[erasedcitizen]

Oct 6, 2015 14:02:16 GMT richierich333 said:

Oct 6, 2015 13:57:47 GMT ohjoeyjoey said:

Look at David Healy. Didn't make it at the top level, yet scored shed loads at international level. Unless we try Bradshaw, we will never know. There really isn't anything to lose by picking him, but maybe, just maybe we will find a gem who can score goals for us.

I think he did play prem football for a bit though.  Also most of his goals were in the championship which is a LOT better than League 1

He said he didn't make it at the top level, which is true. He was a regular benchwarmer for Sunderland and never excelled at Fulham (6 goals in 34 games).

England have also called up several strikers who started out by banging them in in lower leagues in the last 5 years or so. Those include Rickie Lambert, Bobby Zamora & Jamie Vardy. Why don't we take a chance on this lad? It's not as if the strikers in the squad are working wonders.

[cymruramdcfc]

Oct 6, 2015 15:22:23 GMT erasedcitizen said:

Oct 6, 2015 14:02:16 GMT richierich333 said:

I think he did play prem football for a bit though.  Also most of his goals were in the championship which is a LOT better than League 1

He said he didn't make it at the top level, which is true. He was a regular benchwarmer for Sunderland and never excelled at Fulham (6 goals in 34 games).

England have also called up several strikers who started out by banging them in in lower leagues in the last 5 years or so. Those include Rickie Lambert, Bobby Zamora & Jamie Vardy. Why don't we take a chance on this lad? It's not as if the strikers in the squad are working wonders.

And a good debut up front against Andorra might help his career and step up a league or 2 .

[biwmares]

I would have preferred Harry Wilson been called up.

[erasedcitizen]

Oct 6, 2015 15:47:49 GMT biwmares said:

I would have preferred Harry Wilson been called up.

To Bradshaw or Burns?

[biwmares]

Yes over Burns, Wilson is a far better long term prospect so why wait.

Bradshaw seems he may have upset someone in the Welsh set up?

[Deleted]

It seems obvious to me.

Burns has been involved with the under 21s, he is a known quantity to the set up. I daresay Coleman spoke to Geraint Williams to get his opinion.

For my money, as I stated in the other thread about the squad, we are going stale and the call up of Burns only compounds this as its a conservative selection compared with calling up someone completely new.

I worry for the future about Coleman's selection policy, it is very much based on the 'tried and tested' or people whose faces fit rather than their ability on the pitch.

[squatter1]

Oct 6, 2015 16:12:03 GMT @storm said:

It seems obvious to me.

Burns has been involved with the under 21s, he is a known quantity to the set up. I daresay Coleman spoke to Geraint Williams to get his opinion.

For my money, as I stated in the other thread about the squad, we are going stale and the call up of Burns only compounds this as its a conservative selection compared with calling up someone completely new.

I worry for the future about Coleman's selection policy, it is very much based on the 'tried and tested' or people whose faces fit rather than their ability on the pitch.

With us about to qualify possibly unbeaten, possibly at the top of our group, with a team full of players in their early and mid 20s, it's rather premature to be saying we're going stale methinks.

While I too think Coleman is a little prone to being loyal to those players who have taken part in successful results, I also don't think yet we can accuse him of not taking notice of ability on the pitch.

Until Bradshaw is at least scoring in the Championship, I don't feel he's done enough to earn a call up. The professional game is the best judge of a player's ability, not us, and real quality will rise to the top.

[marsvolta]

Didn't Bradshaw say that he didn't want to be considered for selection anymore when he was with the Under 21s?

Maybe he hasn't contacted the Welsh FA to say that he is now available for selection?

(And no, he's not so good that we should go chasing him)

[erasedcitizen]

Oct 6, 2015 16:05:46 GMT biwmares said:

Yes over Burns, Wilson is a far better long term prospect so why wait.

Bradshaw seems he may have upset someone in the Welsh set up?

I agree with you there then.

[erasedcitizen]

Oct 6, 2015 16:28:15 GMT marsvolta said:

(And no, he's not so good that we should go chasing him)

When our striker situation is as dire as it is right now, I tend to disagree.

[rob]

At U21 level Aaron Collins would possibly have been a better replacement than Saunders who has only had a few minutes all season.Collins in retrospect has scored twice ,attracted a bid in transfer window and been linked to Newcastle.Only 18 and in U19 training camp but surely if good enough should be moved up a level-U21s come before U19 in priority, a la Wes Burns.In Jake Charles and Callum Saunders U21s now have 2 strikers with virtually no 1st team experience.In reality George Thomas,Coventry (another U19) would also be a better bet as regular in Coventry matchday 18.

[toshfan]

Oct 6, 2015 13:13:49 GMT sleepy said:

Oct 6, 2015 12:44:47 GMT toshfan said:

For me the key question is whether any of the media have asked our manager about Bradshaw?

Agree with this, spot on. Tosh - aren't you twitter mates with Rob Phillips, could you ask him to ask perhaps. I'll 2nd it on twitter if you do so.

Will do after posting this. In the meantime, Iolo Cheung (Golwg) did say yesterday the he understood that Coleman has not discussed Bradshaw:

[Deleted]

Oct 6, 2015 16:17:44 GMT squatter1 said:

Oct 6, 2015 16:12:03 GMT @storm said:

It seems obvious to me.

Burns has been involved with the under 21s, he is a known quantity to the set up. I daresay Coleman spoke to Geraint Williams to get his opinion.

For my money, as I stated in the other thread about the squad, we are going stale and the call up of Burns only compounds this as its a conservative selection compared with calling up someone completely new.

I worry for the future about Coleman's selection policy, it is very much based on the 'tried and tested' or people whose faces fit rather than their ability on the pitch.

With us about to qualify possibly unbeaten, possibly at the top of our group, with a team full of players in their early and mid 20s, it's rather premature to be saying we're going stale methinks.

While I too think Coleman is a little prone to being loyal to those players who have taken part in successful results, I also don't think yet we can accuse him of not taking notice of ability on the pitch.

Until Bradshaw is at least scoring in the Championship, I don't feel he's done enough to earn a call up. The professional game is the best judge of a player's ability, not us, and real quality will rise to the top.

It all depends on who is available, its hard to argue that Burns is a better prospect simply because he has made a few appearances for a Bristol City side who are in their first Championship season after promotion and who are looking like its all hands to the pump only 10 games into the season.

Comparing those circumstances I would say that its no worse to call up a guy who has scored consistently in the league below. To be fair, there is probably a case to be made that Burns is a like for like for Cotterill whereas Bradshaw would probably replace Church or Vokes. I actually don't think Bradshaw is that great a finisher but I really want to see that Coleman will give anyone in form a look especially when its in an area where we are struggling (scoring goals). It worries me that, as you say, Coleman has such loyalty for the likes of Church who is never going to give us anything like a decent goal return at international level.

[sleepy]

Oct 7, 2015 11:15:10 GMT toshfan said:

Oct 6, 2015 13:13:49 GMT sleepy said:

Agree with this, spot on. Tosh - aren't you twitter mates with Rob Phillips, could you ask him to ask perhaps. I'll 2nd it on twitter if you do so.

Will do after posting this. In the meantime, Iolo Cheung (Golwg) did say yesterday the he understood that Coleman has not discussed Bradshaw:

Diolch tosh. Just replied to your tweet.

[georgetm1]

If Bradshaw turned the U21's down, then it is fully understandable why they haven't picked him. Especially after playing in League 1 and thinking he deserves a call up to the seniors.

If you turn down the U21's and then get into the seniors, what kind of message does that send out to the other youngsters? I'll tell you, the wrong fucking one. They need to prove themselves to Coleman to be considered for the seniors, not the other way around.

[squatter1]

Oct 7, 2015 11:45:30 GMT @storm said:

Oct 6, 2015 16:17:44 GMT squatter1 said:

With us about to qualify possibly unbeaten, possibly at the top of our group, with a team full of players in their early and mid 20s, it's rather premature to be saying we're going stale methinks.

While I too think Coleman is a little prone to being loyal to those players who have taken part in successful results, I also don't think yet we can accuse him of not taking notice of ability on the pitch.

Until Bradshaw is at least scoring in the Championship, I don't feel he's done enough to earn a call up. The professional game is the best judge of a player's ability, not us, and real quality will rise to the top.

It all depends on who is available, its hard to argue that Burns is a better prospect simply because he has made a few appearances for a Bristol City side who are in their first Championship season after promotion and who are looking like its all hands to the pump only 10 games into the season.

Comparing those circumstances I would say that its no worse to call up a guy who has scored consistently in the league below. To be fair, there is probably a case to be made that Burns is a like for like for Cotterill whereas Bradshaw would probably replace Church or Vokes. I actually don't think Bradshaw is that great a finisher but I really want to see that Coleman will give anyone in form a look especially when its in an area where we are struggling (scoring goals). It worries me that, as you say, Coleman has such loyalty for the likes of Church who is never going to give us anything like a decent goal return at international level.

Yes, I agree there's not much to call between Burns and Bradshaw at this point, I imagine it's a combination of Bradshaw doing something to annoy the staff and Burns being a like-for-like for Cotts as to why he got the nod.

I don't think that either are in danger of playing anyway, cos firstly Cookie is going to put his faith in the guys who've got him this far until we get that point. And once we've confirmed qualification, he's going to reward some of the other guys who've played a part thus far with caps and party-game time against Andorra, rather than let some kids who've had nothing to do with the campaign have all the fun!