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Post by cymro on Jun 15, 2022 7:19:52 GMT
Gutted to lose at the death again after salvaging a point. All in all though, got to be pleased with how these 5 games have gone. Invaluable experience for our entire squad. Would have been nice to get a couple more points to show for the efforts, hope it doesn't deject the boys too much. I don't think it will. We've proven we can mix it in League A whilst also rotating the squad which is the most pleasing thing. Some English articles last week questioning whether Wales can compete at the world cup, when England lose twice to Hungary (one a thrashing at home). Go figure.
Still have the chance for a big showdown with Poland in September - as long as they don't "out-point" us in the penultimate match. That will do wonders for confidence going into the world cup if we can pull that off.
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Post by ddirpytnop on Jun 15, 2022 7:28:48 GMT
So current first XI? Hennessey Roberts Ampadu Rodon Davies Williams Wilson Allen Ramsey Bale James/Johnson/Moore with 2 of those plus Ward, Mepham, Morrel?, RND, Colwill and hopefully Brooks to bring trusted quality from the bench. Think we're far further along after this intense period of games. Ramsey showing signs that he can still be a key player for us and Bale will get better if he finds a sympathetic environment before the WC. Some concerns obviously but I'd say we're in decent shape. Looks about right to me. |
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Post by CymruFach on Jun 15, 2022 8:41:03 GMT
At the WC Ampadu has to play in a back 3 with Rodon and Davies. But hopefully in the next few seasons another quality CB can emerge and he can be a starting CM. Him in midfield would be great but at the moment he’s needed badly in the back Cabango |
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Post by maelor on Jun 15, 2022 8:43:48 GMT
What the hell are we all going to do until September now? Relax?! I, for one, am glad that this gruelling set of games is over and my stress levels can take a break for a few months 😅 Absolutely with you on this. Being a Wales and Wrecsam fan has taken "gruelling" to a new level over the last month. Talk about an emotional rollercoaster. I just need a lie down for a bit now. |
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Post by fiveattheback on Jun 15, 2022 8:49:04 GMT
At the WC Ampadu has to play in a back 3 with Rodon and Davies. But hopefully in the next few seasons another quality CB can emerge and he can be a starting CM. Him in midfield would be great but at the moment he’s needed badly in the back I think Mepham's been solid in these NL games, no reason he can't start at the WC. He was solid at the Euros too |
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Post by iot on Jun 15, 2022 8:56:11 GMT
At the WC Ampadu has to play in a back 3 with Rodon and Davies. But hopefully in the next few seasons another quality CB can emerge and he can be a starting CM. Him in midfield would be great but at the moment he’s needed badly in the back Cabango Absolutely not. He has more mistakes in him than any of our other defenders and is very clumsy. He's shown that every time he played for us and in plenty of Swansea games too. |
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Post by jimexotic on Jun 15, 2022 9:22:38 GMT
I can't be anything but pleased with feeling absolutely gutted at losing at the death, twice in six days against the Netherlands with a draw against Belgium sandwiched inbetween them, all this after securing a World Cup place for the first time in 64 years just days before that first Dutch game and the players being on the piss inbetween the play off final ad that game and multiple injuries and fatigue picked up during the period too. To still be competitive despite all that against top quality opposition is quite frankly remarkable, Estonia at home feels like a lifetime ago in terms of how much we're growing and becoming even more together and stronger than before.
Yma O Hyd
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Post by cadno on Jun 15, 2022 10:29:34 GMT
I agree with Gruffudd sorry, without Bale + Ramsey we're quite average and more on Scotland's level. With the expansion of the Euros you'd hope we still have enough to qualify for 2024, but it ain't gonna be easy. Perhaps you mean something different by quite average to what I do? To me, quite average is a low League B/high League C level team, not god awful, but not close to qualifying for tournaments. See Greece, Northern Ireland, Armenia, Albania, Romania & Slovenia as examples of average teams Without Bale & Ramsey we've held our own in a tough group in League A, it's not as bad as you're making out. Brennan Johnson had scored our last two open play goals. Ampadu has been great, Neco great, lots of depth across the pitch. Champions League level CB. I just don't see us as verging on slipping down to the level of the teams above. I expect us to qualify for Euro 2024, if we get lucky and have a decent draw then I see no reason to expect that We're only a little bit better than those teams without Ramsey & Bale, with them we're a high league B/low league A side. I think we'll continue to be defensively solid in the future, but I expect more campaigns similar to the 2018 WC qualifiers, a lot of draws, maybe some narrow wins, but I just can't see us replace Ramsey and Bale's contributions, unless we have some seriously good tactics |
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Post by underwood on Jun 15, 2022 11:17:00 GMT
Knowing our luck we’ll draw the Dutch in our Euro 24 Qualifying Group. Along with the Irish of course.
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Post by jimexotic on Jun 15, 2022 11:18:48 GMT
Perhaps you mean something different by quite average to what I do? To me, quite average is a low League B/high League C level team, not god awful, but not close to qualifying for tournaments. See Greece, Northern Ireland, Armenia, Albania, Romania & Slovenia as examples of average teams Without Bale & Ramsey we've held our own in a tough group in League A, it's not as bad as you're making out. Brennan Johnson had scored our last two open play goals. Ampadu has been great, Neco great, lots of depth across the pitch. Champions League level CB. I just don't see us as verging on slipping down to the level of the teams above. I expect us to qualify for Euro 2024, if we get lucky and have a decent draw then I see no reason to expect that We're only a little bit better than those teams without Ramsey & Bale, with them we're a high league B/low league A side. I think we'll continue to be defensively solid in the future, but I expect more campaigns similar to the 2018 WC qualifiers, a lot of draws, maybe some narrow wins, but I just can't see us replace Ramsey and Bale's contributions, unless we have some seriously good tactics I think as the likes of Bale and Ramsey fade the next generation will have grown. Neco, Brennan, Colwill, Ampadu, the likes of James, Wilson and Brooks are still young too. I think when Bale and Ramsey retire from international football they will leave behind the strongest overall pool of Welsh internationals we've ever had. |
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Post by underwood on Jun 15, 2022 11:25:39 GMT
I wonder who our next talisman will be?
We’re never going to get someone of Bale’s ability or presence again, but I think Neco could be our long-term figurehead.
Colwill has the X-Factor certainly, but he’s still an enigma, whereas Bale was the most talked about player in the league at the same age.
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Post by iot on Jun 15, 2022 11:27:19 GMT
Perhaps you mean something different by quite average to what I do? To me, quite average is a low League B/high League C level team, not god awful, but not close to qualifying for tournaments. See Greece, Northern Ireland, Armenia, Albania, Romania & Slovenia as examples of average teams Without Bale & Ramsey we've held our own in a tough group in League A, it's not as bad as you're making out. Brennan Johnson had scored our last two open play goals. Ampadu has been great, Neco great, lots of depth across the pitch. Champions League level CB. I just don't see us as verging on slipping down to the level of the teams above. I expect us to qualify for Euro 2024, if we get lucky and have a decent draw then I see no reason to expect that We're only a little bit better than those teams without Ramsey & Bale, with them we're a high league B/low league A side. I think we'll continue to be defensively solid in the future, but I expect more campaigns similar to the 2018 WC qualifiers, a lot of draws, maybe some narrow wins, but I just can't see us replace Ramsey and Bale's contributions, unless we have some seriously good tactics Bale's our best player of all time, Ramsey in my view is the best midfielder of all time, so of course it will be almost impossible to replace them with the same quality. However, they're already not the same players they once were and will continue to decline gradually, making the succession much more seamless. We now have a much larger group of good players than when they were in their prime, and most of those players are on an upward trajectory, so I'm not expecting a big drop-off in the overall quality of our squad. |
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Post by jimexotic on Jun 15, 2022 11:30:28 GMT
In terms of talisman I don't think there'll be one anymore, we're becoming more of a team than ever before, there's genuine top level quality all over the pitch.
Davies - One of the best left sided centre backs in the World
Neco - One of the best young modern day full backs in the World
Ampadu - One of the most internationally experienced young defenders in the World
Brennan - His ceiling is very high
Of course there are others too but we're no longer Bale and occasionally Ramsey and the other guys, we're a real team.
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Post by iot on Jun 15, 2022 11:45:48 GMT
My ratings:
Hennessey - 6: Pulled off one great save, and I think there may have been one other very good intervention, but didn't have much to do apart from that. Spilled one shot badly, and also played it out to the opposition on another occasion which he was fortunate not to get punished for. Couldn't do much about the goals
Sorba - 5.5: A mixed bag. Very poor in the first 45, but much better in the second with lots of good defensive interventions against Dumfries, and then let himself down with the failed clearance at the end.
Mepham - 6: Didn't do too much wrong, not at fault for the first goal for me, but did look slightly nervy at times. Potentially should have been better for the winner.
Rodon - 6: Brainless for the first goal, but decent apart from that. He's been much better on the ball these past couple of games too.
Davies - 6: By far our best player on the ball, but this was the worst of his recent appearances. Should have done better on the winner
Burns - 4: A really difficult night for him unfortunately. He lost the ball almost every time he had it including for the opening goal, and got done a couple of times. Didn't have the confidence to take the opposition on too. A useful experiment and deserved the chance after his performance against Poland. Glad he played as we now have a better understanding of his level.
Smith - 5.5: Couple of very good blocks and good pressing at times, but was a bit lost and couldn't stamp his authority on the game
Ampadu - 7: Thought he played very well. He looks to have really come on in understanding how to play that position, the type of spaces to occupy etc. Provided good protection with lots of interventions and was also good going forward at times. Encouraging
Wilson - 7.5: I may have been overly critical of him at times, primarily for not contributing enough, but I thought he looked very busy yesterday - constantly looking for the ball and helping with transitions. Also did well to feed Brennan for his goal. Still question marks around whether he has sufficient defensive nous to start in that position at the world cup.
James - 7.5: Massive shift again, won the ball back for the goal, constantly got us upfield to release pressure, won corners etc. Very good display
Johnson 8: He isn't involved in matches much, but when he gets the ball in good positions he's just deadly. Had the better of De Ligt a couple of times - a £70m Juventus defender let's not forget. Took his goal so well, and had another brilliant run and shot.
I thought Ramsey was brilliant off the bench too, he's really shown he still has that quality in the last couple of games.
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Post by dai on Jun 15, 2022 11:50:19 GMT
We're only a little bit better than those teams without Ramsey & Bale, with them we're a high league B/low league A side. I think we'll continue to be defensively solid in the future, but I expect more campaigns similar to the 2018 WC qualifiers, a lot of draws, maybe some narrow wins, but I just can't see us replace Ramsey and Bale's contributions, unless we have some seriously good tactics I think as the likes of Bale and Ramsey fade the next generation will have grown. Neco, Brennan, Colwill, Ampadu, the likes of James, Wilson and Brooks are still young too. I think when Bale and Ramsey retire from international football they will leave behind the strongest overall pool of Welsh internationals we've ever had.
Possibly. But imo, Bale, Ramsey and also Allen were special players. Those three were arguably more established and playing at a higher level than any of those above at their current ages. |
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Post by iot on Jun 15, 2022 11:50:27 GMT
In terms of talisman I don't think there'll be one anymore, we're becoming more of a team than ever before, there's genuine top level quality all over the pitch. Davies - One of the best left sided centre backs in the World Neco - One of the best young modern day full backs in the World Ampadu - One of the most internationally experienced young defenders in the World Brennan - His ceiling is very high Of course there are others too but we're no longer Bale and occasionally Ramsey and the other guys, we're a real team. Owen Beck looked very good in the bits I saw of the u21s yesterday too. There are rumours of him getting a loan this season and interest from other premier league clubs: www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/owen-beck-liverpool-jurgen-klopp-24210132 He could be our next breakthrough if he does get senior games this season. Heck, if he gets a couple of months before November and does well, he could even be the surprise inclusion in the WC squad. He's a very similar player to Neco. I can see him on the left and Neco on the right, with Connor dropping out in a year or two. |
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Post by dai on Jun 15, 2022 11:52:50 GMT
In terms of talisman I don't think there'll be one anymore, we're becoming more of a team than ever before, there's genuine top level quality all over the pitch. Davies - One of the best left sided centre backs in the World Neco - One of the best young modern day full backs in the World Ampadu - One of the most internationally experienced young defenders in the World Brennan - His ceiling is very high Of course there are others too but we're no longer Bale and occasionally Ramsey and the other guys, we're a real team. Davies would be the natural selection should Ramsey and Bale retire soon. The guy has been our best player over the past 2 weeks, has high standards, and rarely puts a foot wrong. |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Jun 15, 2022 12:33:16 GMT
In terms of talisman I don't think there'll be one anymore, we're becoming more of a team than ever before, there's genuine top level quality all over the pitch. Davies - One of the best left sided centre backs in the World Neco - One of the best young modern day full backs in the World Ampadu - One of the most internationally experienced young defenders in the World Brennan - His ceiling is very high Of course there are others too but we're no longer Bale and occasionally Ramsey and the other guys, we're a real team. Owen Beck looked very good in the bits I saw of the u21s yesterday too. There are rumours of him getting a loan this season and interest from other premier league clubs: www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/owen-beck-liverpool-jurgen-klopp-24210132 He could be our next breakthrough if he does get senior games this season. Heck, if he gets a couple of months before November and does well, he could even be the surprise inclusion in the WC squad. He's a very similar player to Neco. I can see him on the left and Neco on the right, with Connor dropping out in a year or two. I think you're right he could be the next one through. Might be too soon for the WC tho. One to keep an eye on |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Jun 15, 2022 12:34:04 GMT
So current first XI? Hennessey Roberts Ampadu Rodon Davies Williams Wilson Allen Ramsey Bale James/Johnson/Moore with 2 of those plus Ward, Mepham, Morrel?, RND, Colwill and hopefully Brooks to bring trusted quality from the bench. Think we're far further along after this intense period of games. Ramsey showing signs that he can still be a key player for us and Bale will get better if he finds a sympathetic environment before the WC. Some concerns obviously but I'd say we're in decent shape. Spot on. I think Wilson/Moore selection will depend on strengths/weaknesses of the opposition. But generally I like the 3-5-2 |
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Post by iot on Jun 15, 2022 12:38:48 GMT
Owen Beck looked very good in the bits I saw of the u21s yesterday too. There are rumours of him getting a loan this season and interest from other premier league clubs: www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/owen-beck-liverpool-jurgen-klopp-24210132 He could be our next breakthrough if he does get senior games this season. Heck, if he gets a couple of months before November and does well, he could even be the surprise inclusion in the WC squad. He's a very similar player to Neco. I can see him on the left and Neco on the right, with Connor dropping out in a year or two. I think you're right he could be the next one through. Might be too soon for the WC tho. One to keep an eye on Yeah it's definitely unlikely, but if he does get 2 months of championship football playing regularly and playing well, it will be much more than Colwill had prior to the euros |
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Post by cadno on Jun 15, 2022 13:55:18 GMT
We're only a little bit better than those teams without Ramsey & Bale, with them we're a high league B/low league A side. I think we'll continue to be defensively solid in the future, but I expect more campaigns similar to the 2018 WC qualifiers, a lot of draws, maybe some narrow wins, but I just can't see us replace Ramsey and Bale's contributions, unless we have some seriously good tactics Bale's our best player of all time, Ramsey in my view is the best midfielder of all time, so of course it will be almost impossible to replace them with the same quality. However, they're already not the same players they once were and will continue to decline gradually, making the succession much more seamless. We now have a much larger group of good players than when they were in their prime, and most of those players are on an upward trajectory, so I'm not expecting a big drop-off in the overall quality of our squad. I thought there was an immediate difference yesterday once Ramsey and Bale came on. Maybe some of our young players will step up! |
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Post by welwyn on Jun 15, 2022 14:21:18 GMT
Knowing our luck we’ll draw the Dutch in our Euro 24 Qualifying Group. Along with the Irish of course. If we finish 2nd in Group B we probably get them in the Last 16 of the WC!! |
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Post by saturn9 on Jun 15, 2022 18:02:18 GMT
It's times like this, I just wish they were managed by De Boer again. One of the worst Dutch sides in recent memory during his stint. Jocks even managed a friendly 2-2 draw out there prior to last year's Euros.
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Post by robin1864 on Jun 15, 2022 18:05:23 GMT
They've beaten us twice and have players playing regularly at the top clubs in the world. Results like this don't happen by accident, we're shit and literally can't keep our heads screwed on after scoring. Absolutely 100%. We're shit. And you're not an overly-emotional, reactionary fan coming out with crap at all. I mean, we literally can't keep our heads screwed on after scoring. Literally. How many more occasions would you like the Dutch to run straight through us and score before accepting they're better than us? We're on two, so far. |
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Post by robwrecsam on Jun 15, 2022 18:21:55 GMT
Still can’t believe it.
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Post by erasedcitizen on Jun 15, 2022 19:02:20 GMT
Home now, Rotterdam is a very fun city packed with excellent locals and a wide range of bars. How nice was it seeing the sun set over De Kuip from the away end too? Gutted about that result, but the experience for myself was mega.
Brennan is a future star, what a talent.
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Post by quetzal on Jun 15, 2022 19:07:17 GMT
Home now, Rotterdam is a very fun city packed with excellent locals and a wide range of bars. How nice was it seeing the sun set over De Kuip from the away end too? Gutted about that result, but the experience for myself was mega. Brennan is a future star, what a talent. Don’t be gutted. We got to see the bigger picture. Brennan is massive!!! |
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Post by Griff105 on Jun 15, 2022 19:10:07 GMT
Great trip. Great city. Great atmosphere.
Dreadful airport!
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Post by jimexotic on Jun 15, 2022 21:26:57 GMT
Between now and Qatar we must seriously work on the mental aspect of holding on, I'd much rather we make these mistakes now but we absolutely have to learn from it, we can't do that in a major tournament.
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Post by conwy10 on Jun 15, 2022 21:35:22 GMT
Between now and Qatar we must seriously work on the mental aspect of holding on, I'd much rather we make these mistakes now but we absolutely have to learn from it, we can't do that in a major tournament. I know its frustrating, but I don't think we have a habit of conceding late goals. The Netherlands yeah absolutely freak results and coincidence... but Ukraine threw everything at us, Austria did too, we drew with Belgium in Qualifiers and Nations League. I am OK with labeling this a freak coincidence and move on, but I'll be a made to look a fool if it does happen again. |
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