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Post by insertname on Jun 19, 2022 14:08:13 GMT
Their NL form is a great leveller. They won’t be confident facing us with a misfiring front line and Southgate under serious pressure to produce results. It will crank the pressure right up on them. As it goes though I expect the game to not have much importance for at least one of the teams involved. It wouldn’t surprise me actually if it’s us who have practically qualified by then and we play a weakened side. Or maybe England will and it will help us get a result. Either way it’s not going to be anywhere near as crucial as if we played on the opening day, which is probably a good thing really. I think both sides will see the Us and Iran as the big games. I said when the draw was made and the fixtures got announced... even if England are already through after 2 games and can't improve their position, there's no way I see them resting players against us. They would not want Wales to own a victory over England. It will be quite a dilemma for them and the way the fixtures have fallen, could knacker them out for the knockout rounds. But what if their poor form continues and we scrape two 1-0 wins and can knock England out? Given the form of both sides I would say it’s not wholly unrealistic that this scenario could be on the cards. There would be a danger I’m sure of risking players on a vanity project to knock England out. |
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Post by insertname on Jun 19, 2022 14:09:03 GMT
I read somewhere that Group B has the highest average FIFA ranking, so we’re the group of death if there is one. Bring it on! It will be the highest average because of us. In truth we should have been the highest rank side in Pot 3 so should have had a lower ranked nation in our group, but because of the delay of the play-off final we were placed in Pot 4 on account of Scotland being ranked low enough to be in that pot. In truth our group has two Pot 3 sides, and no-one with a Pot 4 ranking. Interesting point |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Jun 19, 2022 16:29:23 GMT
hooky I'm just saying, there's no way a player like Gunter with his experience gets dropped for a major tournament in favour of a player with little to no international experience Reality is that HRK wouldn't have got any game time at Euro 2020, and the same is true if Gunter is selected, or whoever would be selected in his place. The role in the squad is more about bringing harmony, an old head who has been to tournaments, and someone who can help the younger players or players who are actually going to be on the pitch For those reasons Gunter will be going whether you like it or not, and I think if we are forced to chuck on our 6th choice defender at the end of a game, I'd rather it be someone with 109 caps than someone with 0 caps
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Post by iot on Jun 19, 2022 17:21:18 GMT
Gunter - ffs no! Everyone knows my opinion on his worth but come on! I felt he was done 3 years ago and over the past 12 months he has been consistently making mistakes for us has now been let go by a team in the third tier He was always limited going forward as a wing back which eventually made him a bit irrelevant in the current era where full backs are increasingly used as an attacking force and he never was the best centre back but a make shift option, especially as he has lost his pace. Now he has lost speed and seemingly awareness in his defensive abilities - the latter is probably due to him playing a lower standard of football over recent years and a lack of game time. He is the one squad player that has been given lots of opportunities to show his worth but has stood out as a relative weakness defensively. He is not a youngster with potential. So his experience has not counted for much. Who would forget his awful mistake for the penalty against Belarus? Against Poland there were mistakes and against Holland. He was not tight enough to the Dutch player as last man in extra time - not even close enough to get near to a block. I know that was difficult but unless he is having some kind of positive effect on things then what is the point of him? Seriously from a footballing perspective why do we take him? Last tournament we left Robson-Kanu behind despite him scoring a couple of premier league goals in his last few games ahead of the tournament and we have frozen out Lawrence for reasons unknown, despite him being productive as an attacking threat this season and offering something slightly different to others in the squad. Why Gunter is treated as a Welsh icon that merits squad selection as a default is beyond me. He does not deserve to be going on the plane and it is not enough to accept he is Ramsey's mate. FFS - one or two injuries or suspensions and we could have Gunter lining up against the Dutch in the second round (if we get there). Loyalty has not been repaid as he is no longer good enough. This loyalty sees him as our record caps holder too - Bale deserves that honour by a country mile - I want my grandchildren to see Bale's name as an icon worthy of holding that honour not a journeyman who has arguably undeservedly won his last 10 or so caps based purely upon loyalty and some warped sense of entitlement for being a patriot. I have seen enough of this in the office where guys well past their sell by date contribute far less despite their experience than others. Yes - we should take into account loyalty when someone has something to offer but meritocracy should kick in when we have someone who is no longer up to it and is actually becoming a bit of a liability with no growth ahead of them. Sorry for being harsh. I know he has given everything to us in the past and he has helped make our dreams come true - such as his 'brave' run up the touch line versus Belgium to supply the winning third goal assist - but I do not want him to undermine all of this by making a mistake in a big game for us. He has had enough chances recently and he will have given a 100% in recent games but its no longer good enough is it? Some of those objections are fair, but I find some of the other objections quite ridiculous to be honest. You're aggrieved that he has so many caps because you want to be able to say Bale is the highest capped player? I find it strange that you should care. Bale clearly doesn't, they're obviously good mates and there's nothing to suggest Bale is weirdly envious about it. Personally I think Gunter is a very good person to have as the record cap holder, showing it doesn't need to be the most talented player, but those that are highly committed and graft hard are also rewarded. Weird that you should take offence on behalf of Bale. In terms of selecting on merit, is it just a matter of principle for you or do you think having Gunter instead of, say Lockyer, reduces our chances? If you could be guaranteed that selecting Gunter would increase our chances, would you want him to be involved or would you still be against it on principle? Page's determination is clearly that having Gunter as part of the squad gives us a better chance than having someone like Lockyer who would unlikely play anyway. If having Gunter improves the squad dynamics and creates a better environment for boys like Bale and Ramsey to thrive in, and avoids creating negative vibes by dropping a hugely popular player for the biggest occasion of their careers after everything they've been through together, then surely it's worth doing. |
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Post by dai on Jun 19, 2022 17:30:41 GMT
I agree that Gunter is perhaps a bit past it by now - can still do a decent job though. At the end of the day, it doesn't really matter if he goes instead of a Lockyer or Cabango, because realistically neither of those three would get on the pitch. So why not take Gunter for one last hoorah, who's good for team morale, and has been an integral part of our success over the last 10 years?
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Post by quetzal on Jun 19, 2022 17:47:46 GMT
The theory is that Gunter will be devastated if he doesn’t make the squad. I think he goes to Qatar as a fan anyway. Lets not assume it’s the end of his world if he doesn’t get the nod.
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Post by hooky on Jun 19, 2022 18:47:29 GMT
Gunter - ffs no! Everyone knows my opinion on his worth but come on! I felt he was done 3 years ago and over the past 12 months he has been consistently making mistakes for us has now been let go by a team in the third tier He was always limited going forward as a wing back which eventually made him a bit irrelevant in the current era where full backs are increasingly used as an attacking force and he never was the best centre back but a make shift option, especially as he has lost his pace. Now he has lost speed and seemingly awareness in his defensive abilities - the latter is probably due to him playing a lower standard of football over recent years and a lack of game time. He is the one squad player that has been given lots of opportunities to show his worth but has stood out as a relative weakness defensively. He is not a youngster with potential. So his experience has not counted for much. Who would forget his awful mistake for the penalty against Belarus? Against Poland there were mistakes and against Holland. He was not tight enough to the Dutch player as last man in extra time - not even close enough to get near to a block. I know that was difficult but unless he is having some kind of positive effect on things then what is the point of him? Seriously from a footballing perspective why do we take him? Last tournament we left Robson-Kanu behind despite him scoring a couple of premier league goals in his last few games ahead of the tournament and we have frozen out Lawrence for reasons unknown, despite him being productive as an attacking threat this season and offering something slightly different to others in the squad. Why Gunter is treated as a Welsh icon that merits squad selection as a default is beyond me. He does not deserve to be going on the plane and it is not enough to accept he is Ramsey's mate. FFS - one or two injuries or suspensions and we could have Gunter lining up against the Dutch in the second round (if we get there). Loyalty has not been repaid as he is no longer good enough. This loyalty sees him as our record caps holder too - Bale deserves that honour by a country mile - I want my grandchildren to see Bale's name as an icon worthy of holding that honour not a journeyman who has arguably undeservedly won his last 10 or so caps based purely upon loyalty and some warped sense of entitlement for being a patriot. I have seen enough of this in the office where guys well past their sell by date contribute far less despite their experience than others. Yes - we should take into account loyalty when someone has something to offer but meritocracy should kick in when we have someone who is no longer up to it and is actually becoming a bit of a liability with no growth ahead of them. Sorry for being harsh. I know he has given everything to us in the past and he has helped make our dreams come true - such as his 'brave' run up the touch line versus Belgium to supply the winning third goal assist - but I do not want him to undermine all of this by making a mistake in a big game for us. He has had enough chances recently and he will have given a 100% in recent games but its no longer good enough is it? Some of those objections are fair, but I find some of the other objections quite ridiculous to be honest. You're aggrieved that he has so many caps because you want to be able to say Bale is the highest capped player? I find it strange that you should care. Bale clearly doesn't, they're obviously good mates and there's nothing to suggest Bale is weirdly envious about it. Personally I think Gunter is a very good person to have as the record cap holder, showing it doesn't need to be the most talented player, but those that are highly committed and graft hard are also rewarded. Weird that you should take offence on behalf of Bale. In terms of selecting on merit, is it just a matter of principle for you or do you think having Gunter instead of, say Lockyer, reduces our chances? If you could be guaranteed that selecting Gunter would increase our chances, would you want him to be involved or would you still be against it on principle? Page's determination is clearly that having Gunter as part of the squad gives us a better chance than having someone like Lockyer who would unlikely play anyway. If having Gunter improves the squad dynamics and creates a better environment for boys like Bale and Ramsey to thrive in, and avoids creating negative vibes by dropping a hugely popular player for the biggest occasion of their careers after everything they've been through together, then surely it's worth doing. Gunter does not deserve to be the record holder as he does not deserve the caps he is now getting. The likes of Bale and even (to my surprise) Joniesta are still contributing positively to us. Gunter is not - he is making key mistakes now and if he were a youngster or not established we would have moved on by now. Why not at the least try out someone with a few years ahead of them. We are wasting these opportunities by playing Gunter when he is clearly past his sell by date. Gunter is no longer capable of being a fullback at this level. He is also a fill in centre back and not particularly good in that position. So on the next point - someone like Lockyer, Cabango and others. They have flaws but they are actually centre backs and Gunter is not! Seriously lets not be naive here - we could lose players through injury or suspension. Having to play Gunter in an important match if we need to is a disaster waiting to happen. We cannot carry anyone and need to make selections on merit. I don't particularly rate Lockyer but he is a far better centre back than Gunter and has experience in that position for 7+ years! |
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Post by hooky on Jun 19, 2022 18:50:10 GMT
Guys I am not anti-Gunter but it makes me sick when there is a lack of meritocracy and its not impossible that we may need to use Gunter in an important match. We should look at the facts of his form over the last year and make a decision.
From what I see he is no longer good enough but I really appreciate his contribution over previous years.
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Post by iot on Jun 19, 2022 19:28:11 GMT
Guys I am not anti-Gunter but it makes me sick when there is a lack of meritocracy and its not impossible that we may need to use Gunter in an important match. We should look at the facts of his form over the last year and make a decision. From what I see he is no longer good enough but I really appreciate his contribution over previous years. Fair enough. It seems to me you have this principled position around meritocracy (and in the individualist rather than collectivist sense) that I just don't share. You obviously feel very strongly about it. I don't. For me, it's all about what gives us the greatest chance of success. I tend to agree with Page and the coaching set up, that selecting Gunter and the benefits that brings off the pitch increases our chances of success more than selecting a slightly better 6th choice cb would. |
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Post by melynwy on Jun 19, 2022 21:03:15 GMT
Guys I am not anti-Gunter but it makes me sick when there is a lack of meritocracy and its not impossible that we may need to use Gunter in an important match. We should look at the facts of his form over the last year and make a decision. From what I see he is no longer good enough but I really appreciate his contribution over previous years. You pick a squad, not a team. Gunter is a crucial part of the squad, but not a crucial part of the team. He is also one of the most versatile defenders we have to fall back on, and at 32 he’s not ‘past it’ - he’s always been a limited player. But as I said, there’s far more to choosing a squad beyond the first XI. Experience is a crucial factor even when you’re not on the field. |
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Post by jimexotic on Jun 19, 2022 21:47:11 GMT
The pressure on England is intense, they're expected to get to the semi's at least and they'll carry that weight on their shoulders. In 2018 there was no expectancy, last year they played all but one game at home, no travelling or anything. This time they're in the same boat as everyone else except this time around people expect them to walk the group and at least go as far as they did four years ago. I think we can beat them but I think a draw is far more realistic given the options available to both managers. A win would be one of the greatest moments in Welsh football because of the stage.
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Post by aberbeeg on Jun 20, 2022 5:20:05 GMT
Iran are going to be the unknown team of the group. Very little is known about them compared to the likes of England and USA. Plus I always feel that World rankings mean very little when you get to this stage.
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Post by jamaro on Jun 20, 2022 8:25:18 GMT
I met a South Korean chap the other day - he said Iran were arguably the most impressive team from Asia.
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Post by iot on Jun 20, 2022 9:23:30 GMT
Listened to a BBC Radio Wales programme on the WC where Chris Wathan was interviewing an American and Iranian journalist. Iran apparently have 3 really good forwards who play in Europe, one was described as the best player in the portugese league last season. But they're midfield and defence are not the best. They blitzed through their qualifiers, beating South Korea easily.
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Post by CrackityJones on Jun 20, 2022 13:03:50 GMT
This is a good graphic showing the relative FIFA rankings of the 32 teams. You can see how close we are in our group:
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Post by allezlesrouges on Jun 20, 2022 15:13:10 GMT
Having watched Iran in previous World Cups, they are just a very stubborn & organised team with little firepower. However, in recent years they have added a few forwards who do play at a good level
Sardar Azmoun - Bayer Leverkusen - 63 caps & 40 goals
Mehdi Taremi - Porto - 58 caps & 27 goals
Alireza Jahanbaksh - Feyenoord (formerly Brighton) - 62 caps & 13 goals
Important to note that most of their goals are coming against low level Asian opposition, so there's no need to overplay their international records. However they do play for decent clubs & I think they will be a better unit than the USA
Qatar represents the closest to home they've ever had a World Cup too, and I think they will be buoyed by that. So I think we need to be really careful against them. Kieffer will be vital in unlocking their stubborn defence
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Post by joio on Jun 20, 2022 15:16:47 GMT
Listened to a BBC Radio Wales programme on the WC where Chris Wathan was interviewing an American and Iranian journalist. Iran apparently have 3 really good forwards who play in Europe, one was described as the best player in the portugese league last season. But they're midfield and defence are not the best. They blitzed through their qualifiers, beating South Korea easily. South Korea drew (1-1) and beat Iran (2-0) during the qualifiers but also somehow managed to lose to UAE and draw with Iraq which as a result saw them lose out to Iran for top spot. Iran on the other hand manged to win the other eight games home and away against Iraq, Lebanon, UAE and Syria. Since the last world cup the only other decent side they've played is Japan where they lost 3-0. Iran also lost 2-1 to Algeria in a friendly last week. |
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Post by CrackityJones on Jun 20, 2022 16:02:19 GMT
Iran were supposed to play more friendlies this window but they fell through, their federation is getting some stick for it so all is not well across the Persian Gulf.
This is a good insight into Iran and USA from their own fans. Iolo Cheung doing great job representing Cymru:
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Post by CrackityJones on Jun 23, 2022 16:30:57 GMT
FIFA have confirmed there will be 26 man squads at the WC
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Post by quetzal on Jun 23, 2022 16:43:41 GMT
FIFA have confirmed there will be 26 man squads at the WC Just listened to Podcast Peldroed. They’re not impressed with Sorba. Touch and go if he makes it or not |
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Post by shoesoff on Jun 23, 2022 17:03:58 GMT
FIFA have confirmed there will be 26 man squads at the WC My initial stab at this - those in green definitely going, orange are maybes, red highly unlikelies. Lot will depend on the extent Brooks plays over next few months - heart says he'll be there, head not quite so sure. Also think that we'll probably take Levitt and Smith as well as midfield cover as somewhat light there (albeit Ampadau can, and maybe should, play there).    |
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Post by iantov on Jun 23, 2022 18:21:21 GMT
This is a good graphic showing the relative FIFA rankings of the 32 teams. You can see how close we are in our group: Group of death...!! |
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Post by quetzal on Jun 23, 2022 18:44:05 GMT
FIFA have confirmed there will be 26 man squads at the WC My initial stab at this - those in green definitely going, orange are maybes, red highly unlikelies. Lot will depend on the extent Brooks plays over next few months - heart says he'll be there, head not quite so sure. Also think that we'll probably take Levitt and Smith as well as midfield cover as somewhat light there (albeit Ampadau can, and maybe should, play there). Joniesta will go! He just does well for us. He understands what is wanted from him. Looks a threat for us. |
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Post by iot on Jun 23, 2022 20:14:13 GMT
FIFA have confirmed there will be 26 man squads at the WC My initial stab at this - those in green definitely going, orange are maybes, red highly unlikelies. Lot will depend on the extent Brooks plays over next few months - heart says he'll be there, head not quite so sure. Also think that we'll probably take Levitt and Smith as well as midfield cover as somewhat light there (albeit Ampadau can, and maybe should, play there). I think it will be the first 26 you have listed there, apart from Levitt in for Burns, and Matondo to come in for Brooks if the latter doesn't get sufficient game time + prove his fitness over the next couple of months |
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Post by TheWelshWay on Jun 24, 2022 11:04:09 GMT
FIFA have confirmed there will be 26 man squads at the WC My initial stab at this - those in green definitely going, orange are maybes, red highly unlikelies. Lot will depend on the extent Brooks plays over next few months - heart says he'll be there, head not quite so sure. Also think that we'll probably take Levitt and Smith as well as midfield cover as somewhat light there (albeit Ampadau can, and maybe should, play there). Joniesta and Levitt are now certs i think - Smith most probably going too. 4/5 places up for grabs I think |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Jun 28, 2022 0:04:07 GMT
Go on then, why not!
I actually take exception to this tweet, our depth is better than it's ever been. So I've made a power-rankings for our top 55 players. I've chunked it up into 4 sections. Starting XI/Rest of WC squad/Recent call ups/Best of the rest
1. Bale
2. Ramsey
3. B.Davies
4. Allen
5. D. James
6. Ampadu
7. C. Roberts
8. Neco
9. Rodon
10. Hennessey
11. Moore
---------------------------
12. Wilson
13. Brennan
14. Ward
15. Mepham
16. RND
17. Morrell
18. Colwill
19. Brooks
20. Levitt
21. Gunter
22. Jonny
23. Tyler
24. Sorba
25. Burns
26. A.Davies
------------------------
27. Cabango
28. Smith
29. Matondo
30. M.Harris
31. T.King
32. Broadhead
33. Denham
34. Lockyer
35. Vaulks
36. J.Lawrence
-------------------------
37. T.Lawrence
38. Poole
39. Maxwell
40. I.Davies
41. Stevens
42. J.James
43. Sheehan
44. G.Thomas
45. O.Evans
46. Jordan Williams
47. John
48. Mullin
49. Jephcott
50. Hoole
51. Beck
52. L.Harris
53. Popov
54. Barden
55. Woodburn
Others who missed out;
T.Taylor
C.Savage
Lowery
G.Jones
Campbell
These aren't necessarily how I'd rate them, just how I see things based on squads selected & likelihoods in the event of an injury crisis
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Post by quetzal on Jun 28, 2022 0:54:38 GMT
Wow Woodburn at 55!!! What a drop off
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Post by TheWelshWay on Jun 28, 2022 9:28:31 GMT
Forgot about C. Savage - if he plays a few League Cup and early Europa games for Man Utd maybe he could be brought in as a wild card?
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Post by allezlesrouges on Jun 28, 2022 11:46:26 GMT
Wow Woodburn at 55!!! What a drop off Hard to make an argument to place him higher. Not had any regular senior football of note, and is now 22. Plenty of time for him to come good, but players like Beck deserve to be higher as they look like they are going out on their first loans this year which indicates promise. Players like Google getting regular senior minutes also deserve to be higher. Things can change, but for now he's right down the list of names |
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Post by fiveattheback on Jun 28, 2022 15:31:37 GMT
I think Mark Harris may be slightly higher in the pecking order than we think, purely as he's one of our few "proper" strikers I'd say he's certainly more likely to go than a 5th wing back (Burns/Sorba), I think he's probably more likely than Tyler Roberts too |
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