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Post by rushy on Jan 18, 2023 20:31:27 GMT
Makes you wonder what the Welsh squad are being paid if the women are being paid the same, it can't be much surely, it should be a matter of pride to wear the shirt , I'm sure it was once.
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Post by insertname on Jan 18, 2023 20:39:43 GMT
I don’t think it’s a lot, not even for England. At international level it’s a token fee to cover expenses.
What I worry about though is that underneath all this feel good stuff what does it say about the state of the FAW’s finances that they could only do it by getting the men to pay for it? So the FAW get the kudos but it’s not them who are paying!
This is what I mean about a realistic conversation about the cost of women’s football. It’s great in principle to pay both the same but that’s not realistic when men and women’s sport are different revenue streams and It’s looking like a drag on the FAW’s finances if they have to go cap in hand to the men in order to pay the women the same amount.
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Post by hooky on Jan 18, 2023 20:42:47 GMT
I don't think Welsh, Scottish or Irish male footballers playing in the Premier League or at Championship level are playing international football for the money! As stated match fees will dwarf into comparison compared to their club salaries. So this is a modest step forward for women footballers but it is still welcome and again its great our men's team are fully supportive.
The economic rent of a player or team at the end of the day will always dominate how revenues are split. However, there is nothing wrong with women, society arguing for equality as what we do know is people and institutions are selfish and unless people push, they will never get material improvements in pay / investment. Just consider how poorly top male players were paid in the 50s and 60s with club owners pocketing the revenues. For the past 20 years or so I personally think its crazy what players get but the market they operate in dictates things. These steps forward women are making are modest but lets hope this whole process can grow into something big which can one day help sustain lucrative careers for talented female footballers too!
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Post by aberbeeg on Jan 18, 2023 22:24:37 GMT
Well I for one am against equal pay for women unless they bring the same to the table. What have they done to deserve to be paid the equal of the likes of Bale and Ramsey ffs. Barely 18 months ago they were playing in front of a few hundred fans. Now they are playing in front of a few thousand fans whoppee. Not qualified or done anything except failed.
Exactly the same as women’s tennis which want the same as men’s money yet play HALF the tennis and brings in less than half the sponsorship money 🤔 hmmm.
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Post by allezlesrouges on Jan 18, 2023 22:44:57 GMT
Women did bring the same to the table during WWI when the men were away fighting. Women's football filled out stadiums up until 1920. What happened after the war ended? Women were banned from playing in stadiums! This meant women were banned from earning revenues from playing football, effectively ending any chance of the development of the women's game. The ban didn't end until 50 years later in 1971
I'm sorry, but how on Earth can you expect women to "bring the same to the table" in the present day, when the men's game has been given a 50 year head start on developing interest, infrastructure, marketing and professionalisation??
At a certain point you have to look back and say this was wrong, and we need to try and make up for it now by correcting this injustice. Now boys and girls in Wales will grow up knowing that their FAW values them equally - that is a fantastic thing!
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Post by dai on Jan 18, 2023 22:53:43 GMT
Regarding equality, the main problem is that it's not so much that women are underpaid, it's the fact that men are grossly overpaid. Just an interesting fact I learnt a few days ago when googling fans' views of Ben Woodburn. He was on £600,000 a year at Liverpool when he signed his first senior pro contract - that's f*cking mental!! Obviously, that figure is not across the board, but the fact that youth players are earning a staggering amount of money shows that footballers are terribly overpaid. That's another discussion altogether though.
But anyway, I don't think you can't justify paying women the same as men in some professional sports, for the obvious reasons as stated earlier in this thread. It opens up a whole sexist can of worms by disagreeing with it though........
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Post by insertname on Jan 18, 2023 22:56:39 GMT
I don't think Welsh, Scottish or Irish male footballers playing in the Premier League or at Championship level are playing international football for the money! As stated match fees will dwarf into comparison compared to their club salaries. So this is a modest step forward for women footballers but it is still welcome and again its great our men's team are fully supportive. The economic rent of a player or team at the end of the day will always dominate how revenues are split. However, there is nothing wrong with women, society arguing for equality as what we do know is people and institutions are selfish and unless people push, they will never get material improvements in pay / investment. Just consider how poorly top male players were paid in the 50s and 60s with club owners pocketing the revenues. For the past 20 years or so I personally think its crazy what players get but the market they operate in dictates things. These steps forward women are making are modest but lets hope this whole process can grow into something big which can one day help sustain lucrative careers for talented female footballers too! But if the money isn’t there to pay the salaries that the media thinks women footballers should be earning then where does it come from? Is women’s football supposed to be a charity case? Propped up by men’s football, government funding, etc anything other than ticket sales and tv rights which are the main funding streams for footballers wages and which women obviously don’t generate enough of. In any walk of life I am all for workers getting a bigger piece of the profit but the problem is in women’s football there aren’t any profits! |
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Post by hooky on Jan 18, 2023 23:57:42 GMT
Look we are talking about small steps here. No one is saying that women footballers must be paid exactly the same as men, there is also a need for relative meritocracy. However, there should be an ongoing funding responsibility for the women's game and a commitment across the game towards looking to close the gap. The improvement in quality has already been dramatic in a short period of time! You can't leave everything to free markets - sometimes investment needs to be directed towards projects which are not going to have a big payoff in the very near term. Imagine the societal benefits if more men (and women) have more respect for women and better insight into what women can achieve (which is certainly equivalent to what men can achieve1), the health benefits, as well as the cultural benefits and sense of community when you get a rise in team participation.
Ultimately, the gap in pay will only be materially closed by the investment being sufficient and highly efficient / effective in driving a massive rise in participation, quality and talent, leading to an extremely attractive product which is commercially successful. I think the women's game deserves what are modest steps and ongoing commitments to give it every chance of reaching its full potential. There is a place for equality and meritocracy - don't forget without schools, hospitals and welfare available to the masses, which needed investment and a society / ruling classes prepared to redistribute wealth and allow social mobility, many of us would not be we are today and our country and the world would be far poorer. You need to start somewhere and investment is where it begins
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Post by evans1282 on Jan 19, 2023 9:37:14 GMT
100% agree,people should remember Women's footballs lack of development wasn't a natural market driven death,it was killed by the various FA'S to avoid competition, redress is simply just,reparations if you like for generations of girls blocked from developing in a sport they loved.
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Post by jimexotic on Jan 19, 2023 18:36:33 GMT
At International level paying the same is fine, I think everyone can agree with that but the problem comes when a few people get carried away and start getting very vocal about women's club players being paid the same. If that were the case then supporting acts should get the same as headliners at gigs. It's not the female players fault that they earn less at club level, it's just that the women's game hasn't developed enough YET to generate the kind of interest and money to pay them the same as what professional male footballers get. It's not inequality it's literally just business. There's been a decent push with women's sport in the last few years which has been really good, it's clogged up some boxing cards in the past because the talent pool is still incredibly shallow at the moment, leading to some horrendous mismatches. The issue next is going to be the sexualizing of it. It's happened with boxing with Ebanie Bridges and in football it seems like Blatter got his wish as some of the shorts the women are wearing are more like hot pants and it is a concern that lads mags come calling and Instagram likes for thong shots, Alisha Lehmann, start blurring the lines between talent and looks.
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Post by conwy10 on Jan 22, 2023 21:47:07 GMT
Are the shorts made that way as they are more comfortable or fashionable for women though rather than sexualising? My gym shorts are pretty much football shorts, my girlfriends are shorter and tighter, never see females in the gym with baggy shorts and see very few guys with tighter ones unless they are on the bikes.
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Post by insertname on Jan 23, 2023 10:09:51 GMT
It’s just mindless vanity and sexualising surely? You can’t tell me that figure hugging lycra is any more comfortable/less restrictive than a loose fitting pair of tracksuit bottoms. Honestly, the stuff that classes as women’s gym/sports wear these days is ridiculous.
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Post by jimexotic on Jan 25, 2023 20:00:00 GMT
It’s just mindless vanity and sexualising surely? You can’t tell me that figure hugging lycra is any more comfortable/less restrictive than a loose fitting pair of tracksuit bottoms. Honestly, the stuff that classes as women’s gym/sports wear these days is ridiculous. This, I have female friends who say that the gym is becoming worse than nightclubs for people flaunting what they have and people hitting on each other. Have a look at any "fitness models" on Instagram and you'll see the ridiculous stuff they wear. In regards to women's football, the shorts don't need to be that short and tight, Lehman basically wears hotpants as do a lot of the others that are getting attention for their looks. It's really sad that this is happening in women's sport and worse that certain figures are playing up to it, Paige Spiranic or whatever her name is in golf, Ebanie Bridges in Boxing, Elle Brooke in boxing (what the hell is this?), Alisha Lehman in football. There's using your fame and looks to get a well paid modelling contract and that's fine but there's a line that's been crossed here but it's almost like you can't question it. What if a male footballer packing some serious length and girth downstairs started wearing skin tight and short shorts? Is that empowering for him or is that going too far? |
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Post by insertname on Jan 25, 2023 20:25:29 GMT
It’s just mindless vanity and sexualising surely? You can’t tell me that figure hugging lycra is any more comfortable/less restrictive than a loose fitting pair of tracksuit bottoms. Honestly, the stuff that classes as women’s gym/sports wear these days is ridiculous. This, I have female friends who say that the gym is becoming worse than nightclubs for people flaunting what they have and people hitting on each other. Have a look at any "fitness models" on Instagram and you'll see the ridiculous stuff they wear. In regards to women's football, the shorts don't need to be that short and tight, Lehman basically wears hotpants as do a lot of the others that are getting attention for their looks. It's really sad that this is happening in women's sport and worse that certain figures are playing up to it, Paige Spiranic or whatever her name is in golf, Ebanie Bridges in Boxing, Elle Brooke in boxing (what the hell is this?), Alisha Lehman in football. There's using your fame and looks to get a well paid modelling contract and that's fine but there's a line that's been crossed here but it's almost like you can't question it. What if a male footballer packing some serious length and girth downstairs started wearing skin tight and short shorts? Is that empowering for him or is that going too far? Tell me about it! I’m fuming cus the other day I got an infraction notice from my gym simply for wearing the hood up on my sweatshirt whilst minding my own business and going about my gym routine and then you see women being encouraged to wear clothing that is practically sprayed on…It surprises me that it’s so socially acceptable for women to put themselves on display in that way. Like you say, I can’t help but think it’s because women don’t have the issue of blokes parading round in figure hugging tights showing off the size of their manhood. I bet there would be complaints then! And yeah in a sporting context it’s even worse. I hate to think whether it’s the girls themselves choosing to wear that sort of stuff or whether it’s their manager reminding them about social media likes and user engagement. Doesn’t do much for women’s sporting credibility really. I fully expect I’m going to be told I’m old and/or out of touch 😂 |
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Post by jimexotic on Jan 26, 2023 0:25:07 GMT
In women's sport I comfort myself with stuff like this
Katie Taylor - Arguably the greatest ever amateur and pro female boxer, proper old school, no posing or anything
Lauren Price- Our very own heading to the top of women's boxing, no posing or anything
Jess Fishlock - Needs no introduction
I genuinely want women's sport to continue to build popularity but there's also a lot of negativity aimed at men's sport coming through now, you have female boxers saying that they'd beat *insert male boxers name here* up, you have people saying that the England ladies team are better than the men's, really stupid stuff that only serves to bring out the worst in moronic men and women who then cat fight over the subjects. Can you imagine if Saul Alvarez said he'd knock Clarissa Shields out?
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Post by surge on Jan 26, 2023 11:20:16 GMT
Supporters information for anyone considering going to next Wales friendly tournament abroad in Piñata.
(Aka let's move conversation to the substance of what women's team are doing).
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Post by hooky on Jan 29, 2023 21:07:47 GMT
Its not the national team but still noteworthy!
Cardiff City Ladies, who are not to be confused with Cardiff City Women, the team associated with the men's Championship club, provided the other standout surprise result at Burnley in the women's FA Cup.
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Post by hooky on Jan 29, 2023 21:10:11 GMT
Burnley Women 1 Cardiff Ladies 4
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Post by Belle Vue on Feb 13, 2023 8:22:16 GMT
Big bucks for the women this week !
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Post by bringbackelmo on Feb 16, 2023 13:26:05 GMT
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Post by dragonsoccer on Feb 16, 2023 13:28:49 GMT
dragonsoccer.co.uk/newsite/index.php?id=337info from UEFA - more to follow New UEFA Nations League draw will be made on Tuesday, 2 May 2023 Matches to be played over 6 Matchdays MD 1 and 2 - 20th to 26th Sep 23 MD 3 and 4 - 25th to 31st Oct 23 MD 5 and 6 - 29th Nov to 5th Dec 23 Wales ranked 15th in the UEFA rankings Qualifying for the the UEFA Women's Euro 2025 championship thereafter in 2024 - Matchdays to be confirmed
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Post by bringbackelmo on Feb 17, 2023 10:58:21 GMT
I stand corrected, wasn't aware of this.
Good to see Middleton-Patel make her debut yesterday too, youngster at Man Utd, seems like a good prospect and I can't imagine it'll be long before she replaces Sullivan.
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Post by hooky on Feb 21, 2023 15:06:38 GMT
Think Hannah Cain is a very good player
For me, she is our most threatening player - bit of pace, skill and plenty of dog despite her small frame, while she can obviously finish given her goalscoring record. You can see why she was in the England set up until U21 level (and is just 23 now).
Our midfield on paper should be our strength - but James and to a lesser extent Ingle are so quiet on too many occasion. Am surprised Ingle is not more impactful for Wales given she is a first teamer for Chelsea
Fishlock is like Bale. Her mobility is restricted nowadays but she is capable of a flash of quality.
Scots have looks far more threatening but Wales have done well to come back from 1-0 down to equalised just before half time. The best thing about the team is they keep on fighting
The match is on the iplayer in case anyone is interested.
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Post by Belle Vue on Feb 21, 2023 16:27:41 GMT
Poor poor standard of football !!
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Post by Belle Vue on Apr 6, 2023 14:09:25 GMT
Women’s match tonight
Should be a sell out at a bargain £2 a ticket
Get there early !!
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Post by iot on Apr 6, 2023 18:52:25 GMT
This is a seriously impressive performance, fair play.
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Post by hooky on Apr 6, 2023 18:53:45 GMT
Wales winning 3-0 in first half and playing some great stuff
On BBC and iplayer
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Post by jimexotic on Apr 6, 2023 18:57:59 GMT
Absolutely battering them
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Post by Belle Vue on Apr 6, 2023 20:39:06 GMT
83k at England match tonight, that’s incredible!!
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Post by morg on Apr 7, 2023 6:32:09 GMT
4 really well worked goals tonight. Sloppy defending for the NI goal. Team and set up seem to have gone up a level really quickly. Nations League introduction will give them a chance to develop further even if they could end up with a nightmare group e.g. England, Spain and Italy!
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