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Post by luke on Oct 3, 2013 17:44:21 GMT
Why are they all pulling out of the squad then? They're all genuine injuries as far as I can see? |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2013 18:11:39 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2013 18:19:35 GMT
Why are they all pulling out of the squad then? They're all genuine injuries as far as I can see? Ssh! Don't let facts get in the way of a spurious argumet. Personally I will start giving credence to this when Ramsey pulls out, or perhaps baresi will tell us that Ramsey has not got the memo yet, or is not in the cool club with the likes of Allen and Williams who got their excuses in so early they even missed some club games in order to be able to stick 2 fingers up to Coleman. |
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Post by squatter1 on Oct 3, 2013 18:28:15 GMT
"It's like winning the lottery but you can't touch the winnings"
Good line.
At the worst of times, we see the best of Coleman.
You've got to at least like the guy. For all I don't think it's gonna happen, I'd be delighted if he won the next three games and stayed on.
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Post by squatter1 on Oct 3, 2013 18:29:16 GMT
They're all genuine injuries as far as I can see? Ssh! Don't let facts get in the way of a spurious argumet. Personally I will start giving credence to this when Ramsey pulls out, or perhaps baresi will tell us that Ramsey has not got the memo yet, or is not in the cool club with the likes of Allen and Williams who got their excuses in so early they even missed some club games in order to be able to stick 2 fingers up to Coleman. Sack them all!!! |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2013 18:35:44 GMT
They're all genuine injuries as far as I can see? Ssh! Don't let facts get in the way of a spurious argumet. Personally I will start giving credence to this when Ramsey pulls out, or perhaps baresi will tell us that Ramsey has not got the memo yet, or is not in the cool club with the likes of Allen and Williams who got their excuses in so early they even missed some club games in order to be able to stick 2 fingers up to Coleman. Allen first game after international break Ditto ashley williams Ditto bale Collins - fallen out publicly Only j williams genuine Ramsey will come off against west brom with 10 mins to go. Just a very strong hunch having watched this repeat itself in a loop since 1977. |
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Post by Baxter Cymru on Oct 3, 2013 18:44:15 GMT
Allen hasn't played for Liverpool in quite a long time now - Genuine
Bale has hardly played missed the last game or two - Genuine
Ledley has missed last few games for Celtic - Genuine
J.Williams is out for a month or two - Genuine
Collins - Dropped
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Post by squatter1 on Oct 3, 2013 19:34:10 GMT
Allen hasn't played for Liverpool in quite a long time now - Genuine Bale has hardly played missed the last game or two - Genuine Ledley has missed last few games for Celtic - Genuine J.Williams is out for a month or two - Genuine Collins - Dropped True. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2013 21:23:30 GMT
To use boxing parlance, he's got heart.
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Post by yanto on Oct 4, 2013 6:53:48 GMT
I don t think hes being judged on next 2 games but on the last 2 and these 2 which is fair enuff. Why? well we will never have a full quota of our best players that's always been the case, so I think its a non-issue. Are we improving - and this is the key. I thought after jocks and then Croatia this was defo the case but then maccedonia and Serbia blew that to bits. Somethings not right and if its not the manager then what? Of course, can we point the finger at the players not delivering? The only truly viable alternative is Pulis and I would be very happy for him to have a go. Forget all the negative stuff about Pulis - a manager works with the tools he has - anyone who has managed anything will know this is the case.
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Post by texan on Oct 4, 2013 9:56:18 GMT
He's gone, that was the speech of a disillusioned man.
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Post by toshfan on Oct 4, 2013 11:29:55 GMT
He seems to be a decent enough bloke though and his heart seems to be in the right place, so I can't bring myself to dislike him like the odious Toshack. He's just not up to it and hasn't been able to cover his deficiencies with a bit of luck. I agree that Chris Coleman is a very decent man. Both he and Gary Speed were very kind when I had the pleasure of meeting them and both had photographs with my children. I really appreciate this type of kindness. As for "odious Toshack", yeah what a terrible man to have taken on an impossible job, with a dreadful inheritance, with no focus on the u21s to change that, do more than ever before on player development, to change the way we play and bring it into the 21st Century and give Welsh Football a future. A terrible man! |
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Post by welshiron on Oct 4, 2013 11:36:19 GMT
Good interview asking the right questions but wish he had asked exactly what had happened with Collins.
Can't help but like the man and I do feel sorry for the bad luck he has had but he is not the man to take us forward
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Post by llannerch on Oct 4, 2013 12:52:27 GMT
Lose to Macedonia and I'm really fearful for the Belgium game. Hopefully they'll be through and will have their feet up. Vertonghen, Vermaelen and Fellaini could have a field day in the air without Williams and Collins. I'm almost tempted to get Shawcross in!!
However, we will beat Macedonia. There's enough quality with Ramsey and Bellamy and with Taylor and Davies getting forward. They were there for the taking in the last game.
Oh and squatter1: Ledley is a big miss based on his last few performances.
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Post by llannerch on Oct 4, 2013 13:03:09 GMT
Kevin Cullis is now known as Cefin Cylis if it helps
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Post by biwmares on Oct 4, 2013 13:48:49 GMT
Im not a supporter of the Coleman regime
But he does come across as a decent bloke
Fair play to Coleman im sure he has given 110% to the job but has just not been up to the task not helped with the circumstances when he took over the role.
But its time for change & good luck Chris Coleman in the future.
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Post by hookd on Oct 4, 2013 14:43:43 GMT
I have been a big critic of Coleman, but lets give him a fighting chance. If, despite all the injuries, they beat Macedonia and play reasonably well, and then avoid humiliation vs Belgium, then maybe he should be afford another opportunity? As we well know we are not going to get anyone better!
Even though we have been baying for blood, the WFA have arguably been shambolic the way they are managing the situation? Offer him a contract, apparently withdraw it and suggest he changes his support team if he wants to stay undermines everyone and is far too chaotic a response to developments.
I think my biggest problem/criticism are the team he has around him - its comical. It is not obvious what Hartson, William and Symons contribute. To be fair everyone brings their own people in and the news flow suggesting he has to change his support team suggests to me that he will walk - probably every manager would do the same/football managers are a surprisingly loyal breed of human beings.
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Post by njdragon on Oct 4, 2013 17:59:01 GMT
I have been a big critic of Coleman, but lets give him a fighting chance. If, despite all the injuries, they beat Macedonia and play reasonably well, and then avoid humiliation vs Belgium, then maybe he should be afford another opportunity? As we well know we are not going to get anyone better! Even though we have been baying for blood, the WFA have arguably been shambolic the way they are managing the situation? Offer him a contract, apparently withdraw it and suggest he changes his support team if he wants to stay undermines everyone and is far too chaotic a response to developments. I think my biggest problem/criticism are the team he has around him - its comical. It is not obvious what Hartson, William and Symons contribute. To be fair everyone brings their own people in and the news flow suggesting he has to change his support team suggests to me that he will walk - probably every manager would do the same/football managers are a surprisingly loyal breed of human beings. Agree with this, he comes across as a great bloke, passionate about welsh football but if that was enough the majority of this board would be in with a shout. He really let himself down the way he went and appointed his mates as the back room staff. i'd like to see a place for him at the FAW but not as our manager. I feel sorry for him, the FAW appointed him and he will be made the scapegoat. It's them that should be held accountable. Bring on the FAW reform! |
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Post by yanto on Oct 4, 2013 20:45:29 GMT
still fairly simple for me, beat Macedonia and put in a very good performance against Belgium and he should have another chance. I think the players must take some responsibility and this is the time to do it. They stood up at hampden we want more of the same. Failing that sack the fookin lot!
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Post by abwales on Oct 4, 2013 21:06:31 GMT
Quite simple for me. He should have been sacked after the last 2 qualifiers and no matter how we perform against Belgium & Macedonia - he should be sacked. Under no circumstance should he be given a new contract.
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Post by cymroircarn on Oct 5, 2013 8:01:31 GMT
FAW might be waiting for his contract to expire so they don't have to sack him and pay compo.
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Post by marsvolta on Oct 5, 2013 22:20:25 GMT
I think Coleman has too much going against him to survive now.
The FAW seem to have gone against him, most fans were against him from the start, Cardiff fans didn't like the fact that he's a jack, Dutch Ray was having a pop at every opportunity, the cloud speed left, James Collins, etc etc. the list of things against him goes on and on.
He's also had to work with the constant backdrop that many seemed to think Dutch Ray would have got us to Brazil and any other result would have been considered a failure and proof that the FAW should have appointed Dutch Ray instead(we would have been one of the only teams in history to qualify as bottom seeds for Ray to achieve this)
I think the next guy will be given a better chance,its almost like we needed a fall guy in between Speed and the next manager and Coleman is it.
I agree with the posters who say that he's made mistakes but I don't believe the fact that he appointed people he knows a his backroom team as a problem.(In fact, after 20+ years as a player, manager and international it would have been hard for him to appoint someone who has no links whatsoever with him).Many, many managers appoint people they know or have worked with without it being called an 'old pals act', its just the fact that the people Coleman chose seem to offer nothing.
All in all, I'm still willing to back him if he stays but if it goes wrong next week I think it will be time to say 'thanks for the effort Cookie, you seem a top bloke, but its not working.'
If that happens, it's Pulis for me.
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Post by njdragon on Oct 5, 2013 22:32:00 GMT
I I agree with the posters who say that he's made mistakes but I don't believe the fact that he appointed people he knows a his backroom team as a problem.(In fact, after 20+ years as a player, manager and international it would have been hard for him to appoint someone who has no links whatsoever with him).Many, many managers appoint people they know or have worked with without it being called an 'old pals act', its just the fact that the people Coleman chose seem to offer nothing. . But he hasn't appointed a team he's worked with before he's appointment players he payed with. Most managers would take their trusted back room staff yes but he hasn't got any so brought in old welsh team mates. |
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Post by marsvolta on Oct 5, 2013 22:43:03 GMT
I I agree with the posters who say that he's made mistakes but I don't believe the fact that he appointed people he knows a his backroom team as a problem.(In fact, after 20+ years as a player, manager and international it would have been hard for him to appoint someone who has no links whatsoever with him).Many, many managers appoint people they know or have worked with without it being called an 'old pals act', its just the fact that the people Coleman chose seem to offer nothing. . But he hasn't appointed a team he's worked with before he's appointment players he payed with. Most managers would take their trusted back room staff yes but he hasn't got any so brought in old welsh team mates. Yeah I suppose, he did play with Symons quite a few times so they prob struck up a friendship.Not sure if there is any evidence that he's mates with Geraint Williams tho,couldnt have played much with him. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2013 22:56:14 GMT
I think Coleman has too much going against him to survive now. The FAW seem to have gone against him, most fans were against him from the start, Cardiff fans didn't like the fact that he's a jack, Dutch Ray was having a pop at every opportunity, the cloud speed left, James Collins, etc etc. the list of things against him goes on and on. He's also had to work with the constant backdrop that many seemed to think Dutch Ray would have got us to Brazil and any other result would have been considered a failure and proof that the FAW should have appointed Dutch Ray instead(we would have been one of the only teams in history to qualify as bottom seeds for Ray to achieve this) I think the next guy will be given a better chance,its almost like we needed a fall guy in between Speed and the next manager and Coleman is it. I agree with the posters who say that he's made mistakes but I don't believe the fact that he appointed people he knows a his backroom team as a problem.(In fact, after 20+ years as a player, manager and international it would have been hard for him to appoint someone who has no links whatsoever with him).Many, many managers appoint people they know or have worked with without it being called an 'old pals act', its just the fact that the people Coleman chose seem to offer nothing. All in all, I'm still willing to back him if he stays but if it goes wrong next week I think it will be time to say 'thanks for the effort Cookie, you seem a top bloke, but its not working.' If that happens, it's Pulis for me. Well said, I would say that rather than needing a fall guy its more like Speed's successor was always going to be a fall guy in the event that it wasn't Dutch Ray and I don't think even the Great Raymondo himself would have found it plain sailing given the pervading air of doom that seemed to shroud the national team after the loss of the manager in such dreadful circumstances. I too would be in favour of Pulis- although I really think its about time we saw the FAW show some ambition for 1 campaign and get the best man for the job rather than prioritising other criteria. |
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Post by toshfan on Oct 6, 2013 11:58:52 GMT
I think Coleman has too much going against him to survive now. The FAW seem to have gone against him, most fans were against him from the start, Cardiff fans didn't like the fact that he's a jack, Dutch Ray was having a pop at every opportunity, the cloud speed left, James Collins, etc etc. the list of things against him goes on and on. He's also had to work with the constant backdrop that many seemed to think Dutch Ray would have got us to Brazil and any other result would have been considered a failure and proof that the FAW should have appointed Dutch Ray instead(we would have been one of the only teams in history to qualify as bottom seeds for Ray to achieve this) I think the next guy will be given a better chance,its almost like we needed a fall guy in between Speed and the next manager and Coleman is it. I agree with the posters who say that he's made mistakes but I don't believe the fact that he appointed people he knows a his backroom team as a problem.(In fact, after 20+ years as a player, manager and international it would have been hard for him to appoint someone who has no links whatsoever with him).Many, many managers appoint people they know or have worked with without it being called an 'old pals act', its just the fact that the people Coleman chose seem to offer nothing. All in all, I'm still willing to back him if he stays but if it goes wrong next week I think it will be time to say 'thanks for the effort Cookie, you seem a top bloke, but its not working.' If that happens, it's Pulis for me. This is an excellent posting. Some of the attacks made on Coleman on various Social Media have been a disgrace. Whoever came in after the tragic loss of Speedo would have had a very very difficult start. I accept mistakes have been made e.g. not used Vokes enough, u21s etc but I think Coleman has had a rough deal and increasingly is getting bad luck. My only disagreement would be on appointing the very decent Tony Pulis. It would take us down the Northern Ireland route of being about hard work, passion, up and at em, - a model not sustainable for International Football. If Coleman does go, it is Paulo Sausa or Glenn Hoddle for me. If the former, I just hope that interclub rivalry does not get in the way. |
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Post by njdragon on Oct 6, 2013 16:17:54 GMT
Paulo Sousa - I'm sure the Swans players didn't like his training methods and criticised him from what i remember. Ashley Williams was one.
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Post by toshfan on Oct 6, 2013 16:55:54 GMT
Paulo Sousa - I'm sure the Swans players didn't like his training methods and criticised him from what i remember. Ashley Williams was one. Vaguely remember something but the key is to look at the outcomes. Ashley has praised his contribution in the Swansea story. |
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Post by njdragon on Oct 6, 2013 17:00:17 GMT
Paulo Sousa - I'm sure the Swans players didn't like his training methods and criticised him from what i remember. Ashley Williams was one. Vaguely remember something but the key is to look at the outcomes. Ashley has praised his contribution in the Swansea story. Before speed got appointed i asked williams via twitter who he would like as the next wales manager and he said in jest 'Paulo Sousa'. |
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Post by toshfan on Oct 6, 2013 17:02:44 GMT
His views are certainly worth considering but I think he is a professional and would get stuck in. No person could argue with the pedigree and that he did a cracking job at Swansea.
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