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Post by njdragon on Jan 15, 2012 12:05:30 GMT
We may have to accept he is the best realistic candidate for the job - personally i find none of the names mentioned inspiring and dissapointing but will get behind him as long as they keep the backroom staff as mentioned by the players. Because if we lose the players heads we've got no chance - speed was quick to realise this.
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Post by cardibach on Jan 15, 2012 23:16:44 GMT
Coleman virtually admitted on Sky this afternoon that he would be offered the job this week.
He went on to say that if he was offered the job he would be honoured, but it would not be a time to go on about it because of the circumstances surrounding the vacancy, and Gary Speed being one of his friends. He added there was no need to change any of the coaching staff because the way the team played under Speed was excellent and there was no need to change anything for the sake of it. The phrase he used was "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".
From that, I would say that he would keep Ray and Osian, and keep the team playing in the same manner as Speed did.
If that is the case, then we must get behind him. The last thing we need is the fans to turn against him before he is given a chance.
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Post by newaddingtonwelsh on Jan 16, 2012 1:02:14 GMT
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Post by walrus on Jan 16, 2012 5:42:53 GMT
Coleman reminds me of Claudius the " fool" who survived because he was so rubbish no one took any notice of him. Nobody wants Coleman as he been on a downward spiral for a while and has never played possesion football. Hopefully this fool will let Ray and Billy Osian do the tactics.
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Post by flynnfan on Jan 16, 2012 10:33:38 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2012 12:48:03 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2012 14:33:56 GMT
That JimUpton in the comments section really gets on my tits. |
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Post by welshwizard79 on Jan 16, 2012 22:38:36 GMT
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Post by alarch on Jan 17, 2012 12:19:07 GMT
What really annoys me about this prospective appointment is the apparent reasoning (or lack of) behind it. I don't think Coleman is anything like as bad a manager as some have portrayed him. Keeping Fulham in the Premier League for three seasons is quite a feat - especially for a rookie manager catapulted into the position (I think he was only 32 at the time). And his record abroad is nothing like as bad as some make out (Real Sociedad just outside the play-offs, Larissa 1 point off top spot). His spell at Coventry was undeniably poor - but their on-going difficulties point to underlying problems at the club. I can also forgive him his unprofessional behaviour at Sociedad, and his undiplomatic "we" comments, and his apparent lack of concern for Welsh football whilst at Coventry - no more than clumsy statements reflecting his priorities at the time - to his employer.
Putting all this to one side - can anyone tell me one footballing reason why Coleman is likely to be the next Wales manager? I don't know enough about his time at any of his clubs to know what his tactical philosophy is. But my impression is that he is closer to Stoke than to Barca in his outlook. I would love it if someone could show me that I'm wrong.
The truth of the matter is that the FAW were lucky when they appointed Speed. When he was given the job all the talk from Ford and co was about his marketability. There was little, if any, mention of the fact that he offered continuity from the Toshack (and Flynn) regimes - in playing the patient passing continental game. The fact that he was turning things round was not down to the fact that he was a pretty boy with an impressive CV as a Premier League player, but because he was an astute tactician, and good man-manager - and the right appointment for the crop of players we have. I don't see Coleman offering that continuity, and I'd be amazed if he can work with Verheijen. Please someone, try and convince me I'm wrong...
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Post by stu on Jan 17, 2012 16:02:00 GMT
The way Coleman was gushing over Swansea on sunday gives me the hope that he will see the obvious similarities in the style of play we adopted under Speed, the kind of players we have at our disposal and the results Wales have achieved playing this system.
There is no question that it is far easier for our players to play in an expansive passing game than a rough 'em up defensive style.
Everyone always says that Pulis plays the hand he is dealt and if he was Wales boss then he wouldn't play the same style. So why would Coleman?
He probably wasn't any of our first choices but then I bet that very few of us wanted Speed.
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Post by alarch on Jan 17, 2012 17:11:47 GMT
Difference is Stu, Speed had been trying to get Sheffield United to play that way. So he had previous coming in to the Wales job. His relative lack of success there was as much down to the difficulties of changing the tactical philosophy of the club overnight with players largely unfamiliar with that ethos. Sousa (Leicester), Martinez (Wigan) and Rodgers (Reading) all succeeded at Swansea, but struggled initially at clubs geared to playing a more traditional British game.
Coleman may well be willing to adapt his style - but how quickly can you change your ways on the job? Hopefully he will have the humility to seek out the likes of Rodgers for guidance. If Coleman can be humble and flexible then we may have half a chance under him.
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Post by saints19 on Jan 17, 2012 17:25:23 GMT
What really annoys me about this prospective appointment is the apparent reasoning (or lack of) behind it. I don't think Coleman is anything like as bad a manager as some have portrayed him. Keeping Fulham in the Premier League for three seasons is quite a feat - especially for a rookie manager catapulted into the position (I think he was only 32 at the time). And his record abroad is nothing like as bad as some make out (Real Sociedad just outside the play-offs, Larissa 1 point off top spot). His spell at Coventry was undeniably poor - but their on-going difficulties point to underlying problems at the club. I can also forgive him his unprofessional behaviour at Sociedad, and his undiplomatic "we" comments, and his apparent lack of concern for Welsh football whilst at Coventry - no more than clumsy statements reflecting his priorities at the time - to his employer. Putting all this to one side - can anyone tell me one footballing reason why Coleman is likely to be the next Wales manager? I don't know enough about his time at any of his clubs to know what his tactical philosophy is. But my impression is that he is closer to Stoke than to Barca in his outlook. I would love it if someone could show me that I'm wrong. The truth of the matter is that the FAW were lucky when they appointed Speed. When he was given the job all the talk from Ford and co was about his marketability. There was little, if any, mention of the fact that he offered continuity from the Toshack (and Flynn) regimes - in playing the patient passing continental game. The fact that he was turning things round was not down to the fact that he was a pretty boy with an impressive CV as a Premier League player, but because he was an astute tactician, and good man-manager - and the right appointment for the crop of players we have. I don't see Coleman offering that continuity, and I'd be amazed if he can work with Verheijen. Please someone, try and convince me I'm wrong... To be honest, at the time of the appointment, most of us thought Speed was a bad call. He had more tactical nous than we initially credited him with (e.g. playing a midfield of Crofts, Ramsey and Allen, which is not our strongest 3 on paper but offers excellent balance) but his real strength was having an injury-free, satisfied squad of players. Coleman has apparently shown he is ready to work with the current team and not change too much, at least with his rhetoric. That suggests he will watch where he steps initially and will not rock the boat. I think he could work with Verheijen, but for me it could also work if we had Verheijen as manager and Roberts assistant manager. There's almost no need to hire extra people. At any rate, I think marsvolta is right and we need to back Coleman if he gets it. |
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Post by alarch on Jan 17, 2012 17:35:21 GMT
"We need to back Coleman if he gets it". That's a given.
But I'd like some evidence that he has the tactical acumen needed for the job. But then if there is no evidence...
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Post by flynnfan on Jan 17, 2012 17:56:08 GMT
Coleman guided Fulham to a record-breaking highest ever League finish in his first full season in the job, and secured a sixth consecutive season of Premiership football for the Whites in 2005/06. Unforgettable victories at Old Trafford and White Hart Lane, a brief flirtation with a Champions League place, a clean sheet at Highbury and an FA Cup Quarter Final were just some of the highlights of a first season in charge in which the Whites never left the top half of the table Read more: www.fulhamfc.com/Club/ClubHistory/Managers/ChrisColeman.aspx#ixzz1jjrkIpU7I can't remember much about his tactics at Fulham, but he did sign some players who've done very well for them over the years- Simon Davies, Clint Dempsey, Jimmy Bullard etc. Also, he signed Vaughan for Sociedad (at a time time when I thought he was a lightweight lower league winger but Coleman obviously didn't, and he has been proved spectacularly right over the past couple of seasons) And even though I used Aron Gunnarssons comments about Cardiff being 'more professional' than Coventry as a stick to beat him with, it should be pointed out that it was Coleman who brought him into British football in the first place. And now he's doing great at Cardiff. Coleman wouldn't be my choice, but if he's appointed we have to get behind him. The unity that we had in the last few games (between players, staff, fans etc) was something which helped us get results. If we're going to get to Brazil it's essential we all pull together. |
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Post by newaddingtonwelsh on Jan 17, 2012 18:20:47 GMT
Alarch try these Fulham & Coventry Fans views Fulham supporters "coleman was awful and his record subsequently has been just as poor. he was lucky to inherit good players and re-motivated them but he wasn't cut out for the job long term.""Cookie has been mentioned on here many time but he is not up to the job. He may be a lovely guy and a great centre back but a good manager he most certainly is not!!
Maybe he will be a good Manager one day but that day is not today and he is not good enough for the premier league, not even close.""coleman returning would be a disaster apart from one good finish to a season he never done mhch for us our away form was as bad when he left as when he took the job on which was surprising considering what a high class defender he was"
"Wanting Coleman back is the exact equivelant of self harm""I Would Rather Shove wasps up my ar*e than Have that chancer back at this club"cc.fulhamfc.com/forum/topic/search?q=chris+colemanOr Coventry "I agree...coleman has to go now...how much longer can we afford to play negative football?...get someone in who is prepared to play attacking football...""A manager that can motivate and lead - everything Coleman is not!I will now consider renewing my season ticket next year - even if we get relegated it couldn't be worse than watching Coleman's long ball kick and hope game! "www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/6551-Coleman-has-to-go-now-! www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/6493-Colemans-recordwww.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/6559-Coleman-sacked |
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Post by Tim P on Jan 17, 2012 18:27:30 GMT
This is what I have been thinking - it's not a set in stone opinion that I won't back down from, rather a collection of ideas...
Coleman has a poor record. Yes - apart from Fulham. At Fulham he played fast counter attacking football based on a small core of excellent players and some good solid pros. Sound familiar? So why hasn't it worked at other sides, notably Coventry? Maybe Coleman is the kind of manager that is no good at buying players (not a problem for us), maybe he can only work with top level players (again, not really a problem for us anymore). Maybe he was uninspired by dropping down to smaller clubs?
If Coleman keeps the backroom team together, can do a competent job in terms of selection, can recognise that we have a winning formula (which he seems to have done), then I can see him doing well. Would Hiddink do a better job? Well, probably. But I do sense that this job means a lot to Coleman, and whilst I don't think the boss needs to be Welsh, I think it can spur an individual on to do better.
All this said, I am still riled by his string of idiotic actions and comments. We could get to a WC quarter final and I'd still have grievances over this. But if he can keep us winning, I can accept that we all do and say daft things (albeit some more than others.)
Let's remember, he was the 2nd choice last time round. What's to say that he won't be better than Speed? I can say that I had grave reservations about Speed in the early games - he seemed stuck in the headlights at times. And how would he have coped if we were 2-0 down to Belgium at half time? We'll never know, maybe he would have aced it and we'd have won 3-2. Or maybe we would have gone on to lose 4-0 and all the doubts about his credentials would have come back again.
Essentially, my point is this:
Coleman isn't my choice (as Gary speed wasn't), but if he does get it, I'm willing to put aside my personal grievances with him and back him - because I can see that he did good, relevant, work at Fulham.
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Post by ontheroadagain on Jan 17, 2012 21:38:01 GMT
Coleman isn't my choice (as Gary speed wasn't), but if he does get it, I'm willing to put aside my personal grievances with him and back him - because I can see that he did good, relevant, work at Fulham. Same here. |
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Post by flynnfan on Jan 17, 2012 22:17:08 GMT
Obviously the 'we' comment was idiotic, and the 'don't care about Wales' thing was really clumsy, but as a bit of balance its worth watching how Coleman celebrated his equaliser vs Belarus in '98. It did always seem to mean a lot to him to play for his country. www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBI-DeqGKHY |
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Post by leescratchpele on Jan 18, 2012 12:45:47 GMT
Looks like Coleman to be announced as new manager tomorrow:
FAW PRESS CONFERENCE
The Football Association of Wales will be holding a press conference at the St Davids Hotel in Cardiff Bay. The conference will take place on Thursday, January 19th,2012 at 12 noon.
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Post by welshwizard79 on Jan 18, 2012 12:54:20 GMT
Obviously the 'we' comment was idiotic, and the 'don't care about Wales' thing was really clumsy, but as a bit of balance its worth watching how Coleman celebrated his equaliser vs Belarus in '98. It did always seem to mean a lot to him to play for his country. www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBI-DeqGKHYGreat night and yeah good celebration. Coleman coming on for last game against Germany was good too. |
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Post by leescratchpele on Jan 18, 2012 14:50:17 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2012 15:58:09 GMT
Ray to be announced as his number 2.
Time to get behind them.
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Post by Baxter Cymru on Jan 18, 2012 16:36:03 GMT
Where did you see ray will be number 2 mate? Great news if true
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Post by newaddingtonwelsh on Jan 18, 2012 17:31:26 GMT
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Post by newaddingtonwelsh on Jan 18, 2012 18:45:35 GMT
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Post by Baxter Cymru on Jan 18, 2012 19:22:52 GMT
What? Why? I hate all this we are doomed I've lost hope, its gunna be a disaster bolox. At the end of the day hardly any of us wanted speed to get the job, and we wanted him and Ray out after 3 games!! Give Coleman a chance I think he will do a decent job!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2012 19:33:14 GMT
What? Why? I hate all this we are doomed I've lost hope, its gunna be a disaster bolox. At the end of the day hardly any of us wanted speed to get the job, and we wanted him and Ray out after 3 games!! Give Coleman a chance I think he will do a decent job! Spot on. |
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Post by njdragon on Jan 18, 2012 19:48:57 GMT
exactly - dont think we had many people to chose from was either hartson or coleman! Coleman passionate when played for wales with a good amount of experience both here and abroad. Very good mate of speeds too.
We have a real good squad right now with good backroom staff etc i think they are more important to us than any manager.
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Post by ontheroadagain on Jan 18, 2012 20:02:35 GMT
We must all be positive.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2012 21:35:24 GMT
Where did you see ray will be number 2 mate? Great news if true it was in the daily mail. I wish I had a better source. |
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