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Post by yanto on Nov 20, 2017 7:40:54 GMT
Have people seen this? I've also referenced it in the "Ryan Giggs hate" thread.. Not going to repeat what I have posted on there, but here's the link I'm referring to: www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42038653IF true, this is a very interesting insight into the FAW's discussions with Coleman. IF this us true, looks like they pulled out all the stops too. Yes saw it and it does suggest faw did everything they could, given the turnaround in faws attitude over the last few years there is no reason to see this as untrue. Cookie went for the money and with a long gap between competitive games. The former should be enough reason for some negative comments but we all love a bit of hypocrisy😂 |
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Post by cymruramdcfc on Nov 20, 2017 8:11:39 GMT
no one can really complain that Coleman deciding to move on as for a career money and to an extent left with a great history as welsh manager. the almost making to the world cup and big gap in between may have swayed him over the line to go now. from a manager who was not all first choice to his passport problems near disaster Andorra game where a lot had enough of him then to euro semi finals he will go down as the greatest manager so far in welsh football.
as for moving to Sunderland they are big club and money to spend it and at bottom of the championship and as Yazz sung 'the only way is up'
dioch chris and good luck at sunderland you will need it.
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Post by cymroircarn on Nov 20, 2017 8:34:51 GMT
no one can really complain that Coleman deciding to move on as for a career money and to an extent left with a great history as welsh manager. the almost making to the world cup and big gap in between may have swayed him over the line to go now. from a manager who was not all first choice to his passport problems near disaster Andorra game where a lot had enough of him then to euro semi finals he will go down as the greatest manager so far in welsh football. as for moving to Sunderland they are big club and money to spend it and at bottom of the championship and as Yazz sung 'the only way is up' dioch chris and good luck at sunderland you will need it. If you’re quoting Yazz mate you really are showing your age (or a huge 80s music fan) 😂😂😂 |
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Post by dai on Nov 20, 2017 8:40:10 GMT
I've heard a good rumour today that Coleman was offered up towards £800,000+ to stay as Wales manager - whether that's annual or based on a two year contract etc I'm not sure. Either way, shows the FAW may have tried quite a bit financially to persuade him.
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Post by cymruramdcfc on Nov 20, 2017 9:10:20 GMT
no one can really complain that Coleman deciding to move on as for a career money and to an extent left with a great history as welsh manager. the almost making to the world cup and big gap in between may have swayed him over the line to go now. from a manager who was not all first choice to his passport problems near disaster Andorra game where a lot had enough of him then to euro semi finals he will go down as the greatest manager so far in welsh football. as for moving to Sunderland they are big club and money to spend it and at bottom of the championship and as Yazz sung 'the only way is up' dioch chris and good luck at sunderland you will need it. If you’re quoting Yazz mate you really are showing your age (or a huge 80s music fan) 😂😂😂 more late 70s punk than 80s music fan spike hair the works....  |
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Post by texan on Nov 20, 2017 10:35:44 GMT
I've heard a good rumour today that Coleman was offered up towards £800,000+ to stay as Wales manager - whether that's annual or based on a two year contract etc I'm not sure. Either way, shows the FAW may have tried quite a bit financially to persuade him. Snap...same here. Coleman had gone into negotiations on Friday with the Sunderland job already in his pocket. I was told the FAW were rumoured to have offered his 'people' nearly everything they were asking for to take him through to the end of Euro 2020. They agreed to give Morgans and Mitchell full time contracts and 1/2 a million to further develop the Vale's facilities. I'm told it was a case of: "We'll do all the upgrades/permanent contracts you want along with upping your wages a bit OR we'll get as close to matching Sunderland's money as we can...we can't do both" In a desperate attempt to keep him they then upped his money on Friday to that £800,000 IN ADDITION to all the upgrades, but it was still never going to match the Sunderland contract, doing that would have probably bankrupted the FAW. To be honest, I think he'd still have gone even if the FAW had miraculously pulled out an extra few million and matched SUFC's contract. Back in 1993 Yorath was only asking to carry on (he admitted he'd have done the Wales job for minimum wage!) and the FAW stabbed him in the back, but on this occasion I'm happy they've done everything possible to try and keep the manager. I don't begrudge Coleman leaving however as he's freely been discussing how much he's missed club football since about 2013 and admitted honestly that after Russia that would be it. He's been nothing but open, he was always going to go but probably just wavered that little bit in the last few weeks and found it hard to leave when it came to the crunch...y'know...memories, 'feels' and all that! The very best of luck to him. Having said that, I'm glad Symons was sacked from Fulham and came back into the Wales fold, its meant he goes to Sunderland as Coleman's no.2, as opposed to what would have happened...Osian Roberts leaving! Exciting times then...an opportunity to get someone with an elevated philosophy of play that will raise our performances to the next level! |
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Post by cymruramdcfc on Nov 20, 2017 10:38:49 GMT
I've heard a good rumour today that Coleman was offered up towards £800,000+ to stay as Wales manager - whether that's annual or based on a two year contract etc I'm not sure. Either way, shows the FAW may have tried quite a bit financially to persuade him. Snap...same here. Coleman had gone into negotiations on Friday with the Sunderland job already in his pocket. I was told the FAW were rumoured to have offered his 'people' nearly everything they were asking for to take him through to the end of Euro 2020. They agreed to give Morgans and Mitchell full time contracts and 1/2 a million to further develop the Vale's facilities. I'm told it was a case of: "We'll do all the upgrades/permanent contracts you want along with upping your wages a bit OR we'll get as close to matching Sunderland's money as we can...we can't do both" In a desperate attempt to keep him they then upped his money on Friday to that £800,000 IN ADDITION to all the upgrades, but it was still never going to match the Sunderland contract, doing that would have probably bankrupted the FAW. To be honest, I think he'd still have gone even if the FAW had miraculously pulled out an extra few million and matched SUFC's contract. Back in 1993 Yorath was only asking to carry on (he admitted he'd have done the Wales job for minimum wage!) and the FAW stabbed him in the back, but on this occasion I'm happy they've done everything possible to try and keep the manager. I don't begrudge Coleman leaving however as he's freely been discussing how much he's missed club football since about 2013 and admitted honestly that after Russia that would be it. He's been nothing but open, he was always going to go but probably just wavered that little bit in the last few weeks and found it hard to leave when it came to the crunch...y'know...memories, 'feels' and all that! The very best of luck to him. Having said that, I'm glad Symons was sacked from Fulham and came back into the Wales fold, its meant he goes to Sunderland as Coleman's no.2, as opposed to what would have happened...Osian Roberts leaving! Exciting times then...an opportunity to get someone with an elevated philosophy of play that will raise our performances to the next level!with the manager that can work with Osian |
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Post by CrackityJones on Nov 20, 2017 10:42:53 GMT
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Post by texan on Nov 20, 2017 10:43:06 GMT
with the manager that can work with Osian Indeed, that's the only saving grace if Giggs got it...Roberts taught him and Giggs would keep him close. This of course would be equally true with Bellamy or Henry, probably even Robinson. Not sure Pulis would though, he seems to be his own man. |
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Post by texan on Nov 20, 2017 10:52:33 GMT
The connection between the fans, players and Coleman has been incredible. I'm not sure what manager can now convey that passion for the shirt, from the players down to the fans. He has gone up and down the country, capturing the spirit and imagination of every Welsh person he met. Fuck sakes, he's going to be hard to replace. Didn't completely realise that before his resignation. Coleman was great, however remember that a huge chunk of this was the FAW and Ian Gwyn Hughes, they were the ones booking these public appearances and telling Coleman to attend, making sure the team and manager represented the whole of the country, they did it with Speed too and I'm sure they'll do it with whoever the next manager is. Think of it like Swansea...well...the way Swansea WAS about 5 years ago! The structure, player pathways, future road map and the marketing strategies are all still there, they'll just need to get a manager in place that will work within this structure to carry it on. My hope is that any managerial candidate that says "no, I'm going to rip it up" will be asked to jog on! |
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Post by cymruramdcfc on Nov 20, 2017 11:50:25 GMT
with the manager that can work with Osian Indeed, that's the only saving grace if Giggs got it...Roberts taught him and Giggs would keep him close. This of course would be equally true with Bellamy or Henry, probably even Robinson. Not sure Pulis would though, he seems to be his own man. agree. putting aside giggs not turning up for friendlies which alot have been grieved with and i am not disputing that giggs ticks most of the boxes |
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Post by evsbech on Nov 20, 2017 12:35:24 GMT
with the manager that can work with Osian Indeed, that's the only saving grace if Giggs got it...Roberts taught him and Giggs would keep him close. This of course would be equally true with Bellamy or Henry, probably even Robinson. Not sure Pulis would though, he seems to be his own man. Didn't Giggs do his coaching badges with the English FA? |
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Post by 1gwaunview on Nov 20, 2017 12:47:06 GMT
Yes Giggs did coaching badges at St George's Park with the English FA.
Osian's got to be diplomatic in his answers at the moment, he'll be working with whoever takes over.
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Post by texan on Nov 20, 2017 12:55:40 GMT
Didn't Giggs do his coaching badges with the English FA? I think he did something low-level with the English FA a few years ago yes, however he has gone through the entire FAW Trust Coaching Pathway, including his UEFA Pro in Aberystwyth. **Edit: It seems he's actually attended BOTH the FAW and English FA courses at different times! He did his UEFA A with the FAW whilst he did his UEFA Pro in St George's park. I knew he'd done a few in Wales because I physically saw him there being taught when I did my C a few years back. |
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Post by 1gwaunview on Nov 20, 2017 13:01:04 GMT
Daily Mail article 2013 states he was studying for EUFA Pro Licence at St Georges's Park.
Had to complete 240 hours of study there.
I know you can't believe everything in the Daily Mail but the article is there.
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Post by evsbech on Nov 20, 2017 13:49:29 GMT
Daily Mail article 2013 states he was studying for EUFA Pro Licence at St Georges's Park. Had to complete 240 hours of study there. I know you can't believe everything in the Daily Mail but the article is there. Just Googled it and interestingly another Welshman - Nathan Jones was on the same Pro Licence Course and now has far more managerial experience that Giggs!! |
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Post by phillywelsh83 on Nov 20, 2017 14:08:58 GMT
I spoke to Chris after the Panama game at the Vale at about 23:30-00:00, I had the impression that he wanted to stay and build but was in the dark with the whole situation. No one will ever have to take on the Wales National Team Mangers job in such circumstances as Chris did, I genuinely think he wanted to stay and build, there has been no leaving do, good byes or anything, everyone was of the impression Chris was still going to be our manager post Christmas. I think he has taken a job whilst it is vacant as opposed to continue to negotiate and have no work, what I find amazing is the speed in which John Toshack was given contracts in comparison to Chris considering the different heights they took Wales to. Tosh built the foundations from rubble when we were a standing joke. I think its Brian Flynn who deserves massive credit, this team is many of his U-21 crop. |
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Post by welwyn on Nov 20, 2017 14:36:58 GMT
Daily Mail article 2013 states he was studying for EUFA Pro Licence at St Georges's Park. Had to complete 240 hours of study there. I know you can't believe everything in the Daily Mail but the article is there. Just Googled it and interestingly another Welshman - Nathan Jones was on the same Pro Licence Course and now has far more managerial experience that Giggs!! By the way, as a Luton fan, it'd be a no from me on Nathan Jones at this moment in time (and I'm not saying that as I want him to stay at Luton as I am a Wales fan 1st and Luton 2nd). He has a lot of positives, however, his biggest weakness is his over emotional involvement, clouding judgement in games. The guy has a few screws loose in that regard. This is a club remember that he was at for one year as a player and played precisely 0 times for. Yet he acts like he is a lifelong fan. That'd be magnified 10-fold in the National Team job. Now passion is no bad thing and like I say, he has the thoughtfulness, game knowledge and would definitely be a suitable candidate. However, I have seen him lose big games because he has been unable to make obvious in-game changes due to he being to passionately involved in the game to see it. It may well have cost us enough points to be the reason we missed out on automatic promotion last year and it is CERTAINLY the reason we didn't make the Play-off Final. |
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Post by richierich333 on Nov 20, 2017 15:12:21 GMT
No team has ever achieved anything without an element of luck. We've had better squads in the past but had never qualified properly. I find the extent to which you're downplaying Coleman's achievements here ridiculous. I predict reality will bite you hard in the coming years when you realise our squad isn't as strong as you seem to think it is, and we won't start blowing teams away by two or three goals each game with a tactical genius (Giggs, Pullis, Saunders???) at the helm. Out of interest, who do you want to take over? Glenn Hoddle - as posted in another thread - best international manager in last 25 years IMO - got his tactics spot on with England in 1998 very unlucky losing on penalty shoot-out v. Argentina, reckon he would have got England to the final otherwise. Which better squads do you think we have had? We've all but stopped calling up from L2 and and conference with only 1 or maybe two standbys from L1. We've never had so many premiership/championship players to call on from what I can remember. Not the best squad in the world of course but better than we've had before. |
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Post by welshiron on Nov 20, 2017 16:38:54 GMT
Disappointed with the way he has left, just wish he would admit it's for the money as not many supporters would criticise that.
Personally feel he had decided a long time ago but wanted to see what was out there, the fact he has taken the first job offered and with Sunderland tells me he was never going to stay. His comments about managing in the champions league was another smokescreen
In saying that I will never forget the memories he has helped to create, being in Bordeaux for the first tournament game in my lifetime was a dream come true.
Diolch Chris and Good Luck
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Post by dai on Nov 20, 2017 16:56:09 GMT
Disappointed with the way he has left, just wish he would admit it's for the money as not many supporters would criticise that.
Personally feel he had decided a long time ago but wanted to see what was out there, the fact he has taken the first job offered and with Sunderland tells me he was never going to stay. His comments about managing in the champions league was another smokescreen
In saying that I will never forget the memories he has helped to create, being in Bordeaux for the first tournament game in my lifetime was a dream come true. Diolch Chris and Good Luck Same. I still love the bloke for what he's done for us, and genuinely feel so gutted he left. But a part of me feels quite bitter about how it's happened. As Texan stated, he probably had the Sunderland job lined up, and was perhaps using that as leverage for a better deal, or he decided he was going anyway. It's appearing now that he was never going to stay if another option came along, and that Wales was always going to be 'sloppy seconds'. Disappointing really. |
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Post by manulike on Nov 20, 2017 17:46:51 GMT
I fail to understand those accusing Cookie for leaving due to the money.
He earned 250k a year with us, and now will earn ... 400k at Sunderland.
Surely, if money was his consideration, he could have moved to China or India?
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Post by CrackityJones on Nov 21, 2017 9:48:29 GMT
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Post by alarch on Nov 21, 2017 10:18:36 GMT
The connection between the fans, players and Coleman has been incredible. I'm not sure what manager can now convey that passion for the shirt, from the players down to the fans. He has gone up and down the country, capturing the spirit and imagination of every Welsh person he met. Fuck sakes, he's going to be hard to replace. Didn't completely realise that before his resignation. Coleman was great, however remember that a huge chunk of this was the FAW and Ian Gwyn Hughes, they were the ones booking these public appearances and telling Coleman to attend, making sure the team and manager represented the whole of the country, they did it with Speed too and I'm sure they'll do it with whoever the next manager is. Think of it like Swansea...well...the way Swansea WAS about 5 years ago! The structure, player pathways, future road map and the marketing strategies are all still there, they'll just need to get a manager in place that will work within this structure to carry it on. My hope is that any managerial candidate that says "no, I'm going to rip it up" will be asked to jog on! Thanks for that piece of sanity Texan. |
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Post by joio on Nov 21, 2017 10:27:27 GMT
Certain of his predecessors, most notably David Moyes, acted as if they were doing Sunderland a favour simply by being there but Coleman sees things very differently. “There’s not many Premier League clubs as big as Sunderland, with their fanbase and stadium and facilities,” he said. “Not many Premier League clubs have all this. I’m absolutely thrilled to be here.” He does know they're in the Championship does he?!! |
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Post by CrackityJones on Nov 21, 2017 12:06:40 GMT
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Post by ontheroadagain on Nov 21, 2017 20:01:47 GMT
Sunderland are losing 1-0 after 10 minutes. Tough baptism for Coleman.
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Post by ontheroadagain on Nov 21, 2017 20:36:04 GMT
Interesting half time stats from the Villa Sunderland game. Sunderland possession 59% with only 2 goal attempts and none on target compared to Villa's 5 with 3 on target.
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Post by alarch on Nov 21, 2017 21:07:34 GMT
Good choice of title for this thread. Judging by Coleman's start at Sunderland and the list of candidates for the Wales job perhaps it wouldn't be such a bad idea all-round if Coleman does indeed resign.
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Post by dai on Nov 21, 2017 21:38:48 GMT
Quite surreal seeing him in his Sunderland gear.
On another note, does anyone think the Panama attendance had any bearing on his decision?
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