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Post by rhys on Dec 17, 2021 11:09:31 GMT
Paraguay, Ecuador, Venezuela or Bolivia away lads?
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Post by superunknown on Dec 17, 2021 11:23:48 GMT
'All games played in Europe' unfortunately!
Sounds like they're about to mess with a good thing so they can see top SA teams play top European teams more regularly.
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Post by rhys on Dec 17, 2021 11:40:01 GMT
I got too excited and missed that ha. I love the Nations League as it is but if this is put in place to stop FIFAs plans for a biennial World Cup, then so be it.
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Post by fiveattheback on Dec 17, 2021 12:29:49 GMT
'All games played in Europe' unfortunately! Sounds like they're about to mess with a good thing so they can see top SA teams play top European teams more regularly. Could be a necessary evil to stop the biennial World Cup |
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Post by superunknown on Dec 17, 2021 12:30:37 GMT
Didn't realise it was to stop the 2 year World Cup. In that case I'm all for it!
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Post by gimli on Dec 17, 2021 12:45:47 GMT
To be honest, I like the idea of introducing South American teams anyway. I do like the Nations League, but it can get boring playing the same old European teams. I welcome adding the South Americans because it adds some variety. I'd much rather play a Paraguay or a Bolivia than the same old Irelands or Finlands or whatever. And if we miraculously stay in League A we could get Argentina or Brazil (though we'd probably still draw Belgium let's be honest).
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Post by erasedcitizen on Dec 17, 2021 12:56:33 GMT
Paraguay, Ecuador, Venezuela or Bolivia away lads? Sneak into the top 2 and it could be Brazil, Argentina, Uruguay etc. |
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Post by insertname on Dec 17, 2021 13:09:31 GMT
What’s the point in qualifying for a World Cup though? Are we supposed to still be knocking one out at the thought of playing Japan or Ghana? Pffft. I’m sure most feel the same as me in that the World Cup is a chance for Wales to compete against the best from the only federation that can hold a candle to Europe in terms of quality, eg Argentina, Brazil, Uruguay, Colombia etc in the group stage. That people are drawing parallels with the biennial World Cup idea backs up my argument and gives the impression that this is an attempt to cook up a “WC lite” with the typical WC teams that everyone wants to watch. In that sense it will be interesting to see what the excluded confederations (particularly Africa who seemed desperate for a biennial World Cup) do in response. An Asian/African tournament of some description?
Ultimately adding SA teams to the UEFA nations league is a radical step and to be welcomed in many ways but it feels like for a few teams who are knocking on the door of World Cup qualification it might normalise all the things they would enjoy about it without them having to qualify.
Being Machiavellian I can see this being most beneficial to Brazil and Argentina, they have been left behind in terms of quality in recent world cups and are now in the odd position of needing regular games against top European opposition in order to raise their standard to the level of the likes of Belgium France and Germany.
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Post by hooky on Dec 17, 2021 13:23:36 GMT
Total rubbish
its like the Pro 16 in rugby adding South African teams and some trying to add South Africa into the 6 Nations.
The irony is they are considering or doing these things in the age of COVID.
This is driven by the big boys as the Nations League is brilliant for someone like Wales to progress / build momentum but perhaps the bosses of UEFA are just driven to try to get a better formula to please the big nations.
Bolivia - who honestly care? Its total bullshit!
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Post by erasedcitizen on Dec 17, 2021 15:58:57 GMT
In full Christmas spirit, the Scrooges have arrived.
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Post by allezlesrouges on Dec 17, 2021 16:11:32 GMT
Is it also likely that this helps them not have to fly all the South Americans back and forth between Europe so often?
Majority of the top South Americans play in Europe so if they play games there it helps those nations logistically too
I think it's a good idea personally especially if it prevents a biennial World Cup
Adds some variety too!
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Post by jbt95 on Dec 17, 2021 16:56:28 GMT
I welcome this in principle, but they have to explain the format a bit better.
There's only 6 match days available, so maximum of 4 team groups.
How does 22 teams in League A work exactly?
Four groups of 4 and two of 3? How does that work with the final four?
Could it be expanded to eight team finals tournament?
Do the South American teams get relegated as well?
55 UEFA + 10 SA = 65. Why not just keep League A & B 32 teams, and maybe create even a League E to split the other 33. Okay maybe not so good for the likes of us, but I think it works really well with four groups of four. Teams of three and the friendlies they requires are a bit rubbish, as we found in the first edition of this competition.
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Post by welshrover on Dec 17, 2021 17:38:06 GMT
Ben Brereton Diaz will be made up!
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Post by Albert on Dec 17, 2021 20:10:34 GMT
I welcome this in principle, but they have to explain the format a bit better. There's only 6 match days available, so maximum of 4 team groups. How does 22 teams in League A work exactly? Four groups of 4 and two of 3? How does that work with the final four? Could it be expanded to eight team finals tournament? Do the South American teams get relegated as well? 55 UEFA + 10 SA = 65. Why not just keep League A & B 32 teams, and maybe create even a League E to split the other 33. Okay maybe not so good for the likes of us, but I think it works really well with four groups of four. Teams of three and the friendlies they requires are a bit rubbish, as we found in the first edition of this competition. not all 10 teams will join the top tier surely ? |
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Post by fiveattheback on Dec 17, 2021 20:49:42 GMT
I welcome this in principle, but they have to explain the format a bit better. There's only 6 match days available, so maximum of 4 team groups. How does 22 teams in League A work exactly? Four groups of 4 and two of 3? How does that work with the final four? Could it be expanded to eight team finals tournament? Do the South American teams get relegated as well? 55 UEFA + 10 SA = 65. Why not just keep League A & B 32 teams, and maybe create even a League E to split the other 33. Okay maybe not so good for the likes of us, but I think it works really well with four groups of four. Teams of three and the friendlies they requires are a bit rubbish, as we found in the first edition of this competition. not all 10 teams will join the top tier surely ? 6 of them into League A, the remaining 4 into League B So I'd guess at Brazil, Argentina, Uruguay, Colombia, Peru and Chile into League A and Paraguay, Ecuador, Venezuela and Bolivia into League B It'll be interesting to see how good these teams actually are, I can see the last 4 listed getting easily beaten by most in League B |
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Post by rioonamazy on Dec 17, 2021 20:50:36 GMT
But, I thought this was to determine back door qualification. Pot seeding, etc. How exactly is that going to work with CONMEBOL.
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Post by hooky on Dec 17, 2021 21:56:06 GMT
Basically excludes teams like Wales, Hungary and Iceland from the top table right?
That did not last long so enjoy it while you can Wales!
Who has driven this change? It must be a collection of certain countries right? How come it just happens without apparent consultation?
Am so unhappy about this. Who wants @@@@@@@ Bolivia and Peru? That is all we will ever play from South America
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Post by hooky on Dec 17, 2021 21:58:04 GMT
The nations league will be finished in 5 years
Its bullshit to include South American teams
I reckon the clubs has somehow planted someone to push for this knowing it ends in inevitable failure
Don't the tier 2 and would be tier 1 teams see what is happening?
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Post by erasedcitizen on Dec 17, 2021 22:59:30 GMT
The nations league will be finished in 5 years Its bullshit to include South American teams I reckon the clubs has somehow planted someone to push for this knowing it ends in inevitable failure Don't the tier 2 and would be tier 1 teams see what is happening? It's weird how bothered you are by this. |
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Post by cynonvalley on Dec 17, 2021 23:27:52 GMT
The nations league will be finished in 5 years Its bullshit to include South American teams I reckon the clubs has somehow planted someone to push for this knowing it ends in inevitable failure Don't the tier 2 and would be tier 1 teams see what is happening? Sure Iceland aren't even in League A now. This is part of the plan to resist a WC every two years. |
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Post by hooky on Dec 17, 2021 23:48:11 GMT
Iceland were though weren’t they?
I think the nations league was particularly good for teams like ours. They had a chance to get amongst the big boys. If you open the door to Brazil, Argentina, etc, then that chance disappears.
If you are France, Germany or Italy then you don’t really want to play us, Hungary or Iceland right?
Maybe it’s entirely driven by the World Cup proposal but I definitely don’t think it’s a positive for us
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Post by insertname on Dec 18, 2021 2:04:12 GMT
not all 10 teams will join the top tier surely ? 6 of them into League A, the remaining 4 into League B So I'd guess at Brazil, Argentina, Uruguay, Colombia, Peru and Chile into League A and Paraguay, Ecuador, Venezuela and Bolivia into League B It'll be interesting to see how good these teams actually are, I can see the last 4 listed getting easily beaten by most in League B No way Bolivia are a tier B side. They have had a good recent WC campaign by their standards but traditionally they are the pits, on a par with Georgia just above the real dross in UEFA. You might be being generous putting those others in tier B too, overall South America isn’t as strong as it once was (based on Europe dominating the latter stages of world cups in the last 10 years. I think people might be surprised at how much they contribute to this new nations league format. |
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Post by insertname on Dec 18, 2021 2:14:00 GMT
Basically excludes teams like Wales, Hungary and Iceland from the top table right? That did not last long so enjoy it while you can Wales! Who has driven this change? It must be a collection of certain countries right? How come it just happens without apparent consultation? Am so unhappy about this. Who wants @@@@@@@ Bolivia and Peru? That is all we will ever play from South America I was hoping it would be Argentina Brazil and Uruguay in addition to the other league A sides. If there is a cascade effect where the current structure is retained with weaker teams being “pushed down” and new lower tiers created then that would be a poor look imo, one can imagine it would be a real boon for the elite sides to swap the likes of Wales and Hungary for Brazil and Argentina. I bet the English would also love that as a way of making the nations league have some relevance in their eyes. Semi competitive games against Argentina and Brazil on the regular? They’d bite your hand off. Also I wonder how final standing would contribute to qualification for the WC and Euros? The SA sides qualify by right for the copa America so there is nothing for them to really complete for apart from promotion and relegation And further, seeing as the copa America needs to pad itself out for a full knockout round I wonder if we will see the top European side in each nations league tier A group given a place in a future copa America? There is potentially a lot of scope with this proposal for many opportunities to cross promote the conmbeol and uefa brands and create a closed “super shop” outside of the World Cup. |
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Post by fiveattheback on Dec 18, 2021 12:19:00 GMT
6 of them into League A, the remaining 4 into League B So I'd guess at Brazil, Argentina, Uruguay, Colombia, Peru and Chile into League A and Paraguay, Ecuador, Venezuela and Bolivia into League B It'll be interesting to see how good these teams actually are, I can see the last 4 listed getting easily beaten by most in League B No way Bolivia are a tier B side. They have had a good recent WC campaign by their standards but traditionally they are the pits, on a par with Georgia just above the real dross in UEFA. You might be being generous putting those others in tier B too, overall South America isn’t as strong as it once was (based on Europe dominating the latter stages of world cups in the last 10 years. I think people might be surprised at how much they contribute to this new nations league format. One of the subsequent tweets says that 6 will go in League A and the rest in League B, I agree with you I don't think they're good enough |
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Post by georgetm1 on Dec 18, 2021 12:30:36 GMT
There is no way Venezuela, Peru, Ecuador, Paraguay and Bolivia should be anywhere near group A and some of them shouldn't be anywhere near group B. This must be something to do with the Biennial World Cup because this goes against a lot of European federations interests, including ours.
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Post by insertname on Dec 18, 2021 14:58:56 GMT
No way Bolivia are a tier B side. They have had a good recent WC campaign by their standards but traditionally they are the pits, on a par with Georgia just above the real dross in UEFA. You might be being generous putting those others in tier B too, overall South America isn’t as strong as it once was (based on Europe dominating the latter stages of world cups in the last 10 years. I think people might be surprised at how much they contribute to this new nations league format. One of the subsequent tweets says that 6 will go in League A and the rest in League B, I agree with you I don't think they're good enough Hahaha you have to hand it to conmebol, they have seduced FIFA into giving them the biggest proportion of qualifying berths for the World Cup and now they have managed to con UEFA that their worst 6 sides are still Nations league B standard. They are going to get found out by Europe big time if this idea goes ahead. |
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Post by conwy10 on Dec 18, 2021 15:00:02 GMT
I liked the first Nations League, then UEFA messed about so no teams got relegated, which made it easier at the top, 4 teams is better than 3. But as a result we've got 4 teams in the draw who still don't know if they'll be in pot 3 or 4 with one pot in 4 containing 4 teams and another containing 3. Now we are introducing South American teams so does that mean some in B, C and D won't be promoted to make room?
For me its getting too complicated, teething problems is expected, but it's constant change. When we get in a system it changes. Why not put them in League D and let them work their way up. If Brazil smash Andorra 8-0 its the same as European qualifying anyway.
Only other way is complete reboot based on World Rankings.
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Post by conwy10 on Dec 18, 2021 15:08:14 GMT
Iceland were though weren’t they? I think the nations league was particularly good for teams like ours. They had a chance to get amongst the big boys. If you open the door to Brazil, Argentina, etc, then that chance disappears. If you are France, Germany or Italy then you don’t really want to play us, Hungary or Iceland right? Maybe it’s entirely driven by the World Cup proposal but I definitely don’t think it’s a positive for us They might not like playing us, but we've earned the right to compete with them. I didn't particularly like Switzerland beating France, or Sweden finishing above Spain in the Euros as I personally want the latter stages of the finals to be the teams with pedigree going at it, but if teams earn the right. |
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Post by conwy10 on Dec 18, 2021 15:14:51 GMT
Didn't realise it was to stop the 2 year World Cup. In that case I'm all for it! Being realistic maybe it is time for it. History and tradition are great and everything, but if sponsors are willing to pay and money is there to be made why wouldn't they eventually do it? Fifa is there to make money and gain power, if they earn less every World Cup and water it down but still make an overall profit from it by doing it more regularly then I think they'll go for it at some point. |
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Post by fiveattheback on Dec 18, 2021 16:40:24 GMT
One of the subsequent tweets says that 6 will go in League A and the rest in League B, I agree with you I don't think they're good enough Hahaha you have to hand it to conmebol, they have seduced FIFA into giving them the biggest proportion of qualifying berths for the World Cup and now they have managed to con UEFA that their worst 6 sides are still Nations league B standard. They are going to get found out by Europe big time if this idea goes ahead. It will be interesting to see how good they are, I think it'll be a rude awakening for people who seem to think non-European teams are better. It's like the North American teams who get hyped up all the time as these great sides only for them to play a half decent European side and get beat. Most obvious recent example I can think of is our B team beating Mexico with Jonny Williams & Tom Lawrence at wing back and a back three of Gunter, Cabango and Norrington-Davies! |
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