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Post by iot on Sept 15, 2023 7:49:27 GMT
Page is going to really have to earn his money in this next game. Against Latvia, we lined up with something like:
Ward
Meps Rodon Davies
Roberts JJ Amps Williams
Rambo
Wilson
Johnson
We had the back five and JJ-Amps double pivot which made us much more solid, and Rambo playing slightly on the left and not quite as part of the front three. So if we assume we need to stick with those 7 players (back 5 and 2-man midfield), and Rambo plays a similar role, it leaves us with just 2 from Moore, James, Johnson, and Wilson (and Brooks) to select from. That's a really difficult call to make. I was hoping (and still am) that Johnson becomes the main man in the post-Bale era. It would be a big call to drop your £50m main forward, however, I think we'll have to. Bearing in mind the quality of the opposition, we can't carry any passengers in this one, so I'd probably go for the more industrious players over the higher quality ones. I think I'd go with:
Ward
Meps Rodon Davies
Roberts JJ Amps Williams
Rambo
Moore James
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Post by njdragon on Sept 15, 2023 8:11:11 GMT
Agree, i think James has done more for us in a wales shirt and i think brooks is better than johnson right now. He Looks sharp.
2 great subs to come on in brooks and johnson though!!
3 if you include wilson, i think he's done well the last 2 games
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Post by CrackityJones on Sept 15, 2023 8:56:41 GMT
That's what I'd like to see, James and Moore worked well in that set up for WC qualification. Brennan, Brooks and Wilson are all great options to bring off the bench.
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Post by iot on Sept 15, 2023 9:10:00 GMT
That's what I'd like to see, James and Moore worked well in that set up for WC qualification. Brennan, Brooks and Wilson are all great options to bring off the bench. Yeah that's the reasoning I had - some of our best performances under Page (e.g. Czech away) had Moore and James as split forwards up front, with wing backs providing the width and Rambo pulling the strings behind. But it's really harsh on Wilson, who's been one of our better players recently and really puts a shift in. Others would also say we need to persevere with Johnson as our main man given he's the only one in our squad capable of being a top player. |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Sept 15, 2023 9:42:47 GMT
I want to see us really try to counter on Croatia with pace, I think that's our best chance of getting a goal. I actually feel more confident about us scoring against teams where we have space to counter attack, so I think we can be a threat
In possession;
Ward
Mepham-Rodon-Davies
Connor-Ampadu-JJ-Neco
Brooks
Brennan-James
Out of possession;
Ward
Mepham-Rodon-Davies
Connor-Ampadu-JJ-Neco
Brooks-DJ
Brennan
Obviously that means leaving Moore & Ramsey out, but I think that's the right move. The whole point of having a target man is to have runners moving off him, but if we only have 1 of James/Brennan as well as Ramsey running off him then I don't see the point in starting him. If we were playing 4-2-3-1 I'd start Moore, but I think we all agree it will be a back 5, so I don't think Moore is what we need for that. We need mobile forwards. Moore can come on for the last half our to be a threat from set pieces and try and hold up the ball if we need a long ball outlet.
Now I can almost guarantee Ramsey won't be left out, because he's the captain and I don't think Page has it in him to make a call like that. But it makes so much more sense and it's what I would do. Here's the evidence...
If you skip to 2:33 of this highlights video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxYpvv9vEK8&ab_channel=Sgorio) to watch our 2nd goal back. Look where Brooks is when Wilson wins the ball back - he's standing at the edge of the centre circle inside our own half. About 8 seconds later he's dinking the ball into the net 6 yards out from goal. He shows determination, pace and dynamism to get into that position. If that was Ramsey that goal wouldn't be scored, simple as.
I love Rambo, but we know Croatia are going to have 60-70% possession, and we know the space is in behind. We need to pick the players that will do the most damage, even if that means putting our captain on the bench for one game. Against a team that sits in Rambo is better suited, but I don't think he's well suited to this game
Brooks, Brennan, DJ - that's a pacey frightening front 3 to defend against if there's space in behind. If we can nick a goal early on then we could have a great night
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Post by CrackityJones on Sept 15, 2023 10:00:09 GMT
You could argue Brooks wouldn't have been in that position if he'd played the full 90, he's the perfect impact sub at the moment. We're going to need experience in the middle so Ramsey will definitely get the nod and Dai hopefully producing some magic again late on.
If Brennan hits the ground running at Spurs he'll be hard to leave out so I wouldn't have a problem with him starting over Moore. Its going to be an interesting month of club football between now and then.
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Post by iot on Sept 15, 2023 10:17:13 GMT
Think we'll need Moore as an out ball. Unfortunately, we don't have any keepers that can distribute effectively currently. Ward can only go to the centre backs either side when playing it short, he doesn't trust his own ability to zip it into midfield when they come short, which makes it easy for any half decent press to shut it down. There were many opportunities in the last two games where it was on and players like JJ were calling for it, but Ward would just go for the safer option. It meant that when Latvia were pressing us towards the end of the first half, Ward just resorted to long balls, which immediately came back at us 90% of the time. That's where we will need Moore. He can also run the channels and is a work horse, so I think he's the right profile for the Croatia game.
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Post by allezlesrouges on Sept 15, 2023 10:25:46 GMT
You could argue Brooks wouldn't have been in that position if he'd played the full 90, he's the perfect impact sub at the moment. We're going to need experience in the middle so Ramsey will definitely get the nod, with Dai hopefully producing some magic again late on. If Brennan hits the ground running at Spurs he'll be hard to leave out so I wouldn't have a problem with him starting over Moore. Its going to be an interesting month of club football between now and then. That's true, although he's made that run after being the pitch for 45 minutes, not like it was a 15 minute cameo. I want us causing them trouble on the counter from the first minute, and I'd rather try and get a goal early than be searching for a goal 60-70 mins in with tired legs. Ramsey's experience will be invaluable coming on if the game is finely poised |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Sept 15, 2023 10:28:25 GMT
Think we'll need Moore as an out ball. Unfortunately, we don't have any keepers that can distribute effectively currently. Ward can only go to the centre backs either side when playing it short, he doesn't trust his own ability to zip it into midfield when they come short, which makes it easy for any half decent press to shut it down. There were many opportunities in the last two games where it was on and players like JJ were calling for it, but Ward would just go for the safer option. It meant that when Latvia were pressing us towards the end of the first half, Ward just resorted to long balls, which immediately came back at us 90% of the time. That's where we will need Moore. He can also run the channels and is a work horse, so I think he's the right profile for the Croatia game. I do think Moore as an out ball is a touch overrated in the sense that we often rely on sending it up to him and neglect playing out from the back at all. In games like the Iran game it got figured out quite easily, and I just think if we have Moore and Ramsey on the pitch then we only have DJ or Brennan for pace - only 1 will play in that instance. I think Moore as an out ball isn't as effective if we've only got 1 player who have the legs to get in behind him That's just my opinion |
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Post by iot on Sept 15, 2023 12:01:11 GMT
Think we'll need Moore as an out ball. Unfortunately, we don't have any keepers that can distribute effectively currently. Ward can only go to the centre backs either side when playing it short, he doesn't trust his own ability to zip it into midfield when they come short, which makes it easy for any half decent press to shut it down. There were many opportunities in the last two games where it was on and players like JJ were calling for it, but Ward would just go for the safer option. It meant that when Latvia were pressing us towards the end of the first half, Ward just resorted to long balls, which immediately came back at us 90% of the time. That's where we will need Moore. He can also run the channels and is a work horse, so I think he's the right profile for the Croatia game. I do think Moore as an out ball is a touch overrated in the sense that we often rely on sending it up to him and neglect playing out from the back at all. In games like the Iran game it got figured out quite easily, and I just think if we have Moore and Ramsey on the pitch then we only have DJ or Brennan for pace - only 1 will play in that instance. I think Moore as an out ball isn't as effective if we've only got 1 player who have the legs to get in behind him That's just my opinion Yeah fair enough, although don't underestimate how quick Moore is himself and the Moore-James-Rambo trio has worked brilliantly for us in the past (notably Czech away). As I said, like it or not the option to go long is important for us because we don't have a keeper that's comfortable playing it out. We went long on several occasions against Latvia and it just created more pressure on ourselves. I can't see a front two of James and Johnson helping that issue. |
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Post by winsumluzsum on Sept 15, 2023 13:23:21 GMT
This is where Page earns his corn, or not... It's when he has to make tricky decisions that he tends to come unstuck. At least we're not debating the defensive positions, especially defensive mid.
I tend to agree with iot on this although the other suggestions have a lot to commend them. Chances are that injuries and lack of game time will simplify things come game time.
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Post by allezlesrouges on Sept 15, 2023 14:14:19 GMT
I do think Moore as an out ball is a touch overrated in the sense that we often rely on sending it up to him and neglect playing out from the back at all. In games like the Iran game it got figured out quite easily, and I just think if we have Moore and Ramsey on the pitch then we only have DJ or Brennan for pace - only 1 will play in that instance. I think Moore as an out ball isn't as effective if we've only got 1 player who have the legs to get in behind him That's just my opinion Yeah fair enough, although don't underestimate how quick Moore is himself and the Moore-James-Rambo trio has worked brilliantly for us in the past (notably Czech away). As I said, like it or not the option to go long is important for us because we don't have a keeper that's comfortable playing it out. We went long on several occasions against Latvia and it just created more pressure on ourselves. I can't see a front two of James and Johnson helping that issue. As I was typing this I did think about the Moore-James combo in that particular game which did work brilliantly. I guess i'm just thinking about the fact that this Croatia side is better than that Czech side imo The goalkeeping issue is a problem, but I do think that having 3 mobile forwards might be a decent way to be able to go long too if done well - but I accept that's not something we've definitely got in our locker yet |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Sept 15, 2023 14:15:11 GMT
This is where Page earns his corn, or not... It's when he has to make tricky decisions that he tends to come unstuck. At least we're not debating the defensive positions, especially defensive mid. I tend to agree with iot on this although the other suggestions have a lot to commend them. Chances are that injuries and lack of game time will simplify things come game time. Injuries always do end up resulting in compromises on the team to be fair, very unlikely everyone will be fit |
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Post by cogancoronation31 on Sept 15, 2023 15:01:51 GMT
I believe that the Croatia tickets are on general sale as from Monday, 18 September 2023 - anyone know how many have gone so far to Wal Goch/Red Wall members, and to tournament ticket-holders?
Are some people still a bit sulky after the Armenia result at home, or will they return? Has the win in Latvia geed folks up?
(Not sure once again that a school term-time Sunday evening late kick-off is ideal for attracting fans from further afield than South-East Wales or the younger, school age, fan base).
I personally don't think it will be a 33,300 sell-out but we may get something approaching the 30,000 mark.
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Post by fiveattheback on Sept 15, 2023 16:24:23 GMT
Think we'll need Moore as an out ball. Unfortunately, we don't have any keepers that can distribute effectively currently. Ward can only go to the centre backs either side when playing it short, he doesn't trust his own ability to zip it into midfield when they come short, which makes it easy for any half decent press to shut it down. There were many opportunities in the last two games where it was on and players like JJ were calling for it, but Ward would just go for the safer option. It meant that when Latvia were pressing us towards the end of the first half, Ward just resorted to long balls, which immediately came back at us 90% of the time. That's where we will need Moore. He can also run the channels and is a work horse, so I think he's the right profile for the Croatia game. I do think Moore as an out ball is a touch overrated in the sense that we often rely on sending it up to him and neglect playing out from the back at all. In games like the Iran game it got figured out quite easily, and I just think if we have Moore and Ramsey on the pitch then we only have DJ or Brennan for pace - only 1 will play in that instance. I think Moore as an out ball isn't as effective if we've only got 1 player who have the legs to get in behind him That's just my opinion Moore's no slouch himself to be fair. He's not got the acceleration of James or Johnson but I wouldn't describe him as slow |
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Post by jbt95 on Sept 15, 2023 17:03:22 GMT
I believe that the Croatia tickets are on general sale as from Monday, 18 September 2023 - anyone know how many have gone so far to Wal Goch/Red Wall members, and to tournament ticket-holders? Are some people still a bit sulky after the Armenia result at home, or will they return? Has the win in Latvia geed folks up? (Not sure once again that a school term-time Sunday evening late kick-off is ideal for attracting fans from further afield than South-East Wales or the younger, school age, fan base). I personally don't think it will be a 33,300 sell-out but we may get something approaching the 30,000 mark. Some left together in the family stand and level 4/5 of the Grandstand but other than that’s it’s just the red seats left. Just the ends of level 5 not opened yet. It’ll probably sell out on the days leading up to the game I would think, think that’s what happened with Latvia? |
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Post by conwy10 on Sept 16, 2023 20:13:54 GMT
I don't think it will be the game for Ramsey to be honest. I'd much rather just put someone fast in there to keep the Croatians worried.
Ward
Roberts Mepham Rodon Davies Neco
J James Ampadu
Johnson Moore D James
Similar to the Belgium away game where we just kept 3 up there and hope the defence can hold out.
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Post by dai on Sept 16, 2023 21:50:13 GMT
Wilson or Ramsey has to play for me. I'd go with the former, because he's looked hungry and up for it in the last two games.
That leaves the front two of either Johnson/Moore/James/Brooks.
This is the issue with playing 5 at the back, it leaves little room upfield where there's a decent choice of attackers if all fit.
If Wilson, Brooks and Johnson are PL regulars by the next international break, then it will be difficult not to start all three.
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Post by saturn9 on Sept 20, 2023 12:15:46 GMT
Although there's certainly more to Croatia than one player. Ivan Perisic out for 5/6 months. Could do with another half a dozen Croats to miss the Cymru match
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Post by jbt95 on Sept 20, 2023 16:55:04 GMT
I believe that the Croatia tickets are on general sale as from Monday, 18 September 2023. Only the corners of level 5 Ninian and level 4 Grandstand left now, only single seats elsewhere, surely will be a sell out with over 3 weeks to go yet. I’m happily surprised. |
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Post by cogancoronation31 on Sept 20, 2023 19:21:16 GMT
Will Croatia sell out their allocation? (And how much will that be - 2,000?)
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Post by jbt95 on Sept 20, 2023 21:07:17 GMT
Will Croatia sell out their allocation? (And how much will that be - 2,000?) They brought quite a few 4 years ago |
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Post by barneycat1 on Sept 21, 2023 19:42:04 GMT
It looks like there are only about 1500 tickets left.
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Post by oldman on Sept 22, 2023 9:51:13 GMT
Wilson or Ramsey has to play for me. I'd go with the former, because he's looked hungry and up for it in the last two games. That leaves the front two of either Johnson/Moore/James/Brooks. This is the issue with playing 5 at the back, it leaves little room upfield where there's a decent choice of attackers if all fit. If Wilson, Brooks and Johnson are PL regulars by the next international break, then it will be difficult not to start all three. Ramsey starts for me. He's playing regularly at Cardiff and is improving every time he plays. Plus his fitness levels are much better than at the start of the season |
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Post by manulike on Sept 22, 2023 16:58:57 GMT
Am I reading this right. People on here are actually calling to drop Rambo? Our best and most imaginative / creative player by a country mile? A Ramsey that is actually playing weekly AND looking happier and hungrier than he has for ages?
#NO.WAY
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Post by turkpower on Sept 23, 2023 13:23:29 GMT
Spot on as always manulike
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Post by allezlesrouges on Sept 23, 2023 15:06:44 GMT
Am I reading this right. People on here are actually calling to drop Rambo? Our best and most imaginative / creative player by a country mile? A Ramsey that is actually playing weekly AND looking happier and hungrier than he has for ages? #NO.WAY If I'm picking a team that I think is most capable of getting a result against Croatia then Rambo isn't in that, because of his characteristics & the characteristics of other players I agree with you he's our most imaginative & creative player, and he's in the best head space, and physical condition he's been in for a while But none of that means he's the correct type of player to hurt Croatia |
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Post by melynwy on Sept 23, 2023 17:14:49 GMT
Am I reading this right. People on here are actually calling to drop Rambo? Our best and most imaginative / creative player by a country mile? A Ramsey that is actually playing weekly AND looking happier and hungrier than he has for ages? #NO.WAY That's a rather sensationalist/tabloid response to allezlesrouges 's very reasonable and well argued point! I'd almost say you've intentionally 'misunderstood' his point. |
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Post by jimexotic on Sept 23, 2023 17:50:55 GMT
Am I reading this right. People on here are actually calling to drop Rambo? Our best and most imaginative / creative player by a country mile? A Ramsey that is actually playing weekly AND looking happier and hungrier than he has for ages? #NO.WAY If I'm picking a team that I think is most capable of getting a result against Croatia then Rambo isn't in that, because of his characteristics & the characteristics of other players I agree with you he's our most imaginative & creative player, and he's in the best head space, and physical condition he's been in for a while But none of that means he's the correct type of player to hurt Croatia I tend to agree with this, it's the kind of game that could pass him by because his style isn't to dig in and "put a shift in" which is required in these kind of games from everyone for us right now because there's a quality gap that has to be bridged. He's our best player but it's horses for courses, not an art show. That reads quite depressingly I know but if Ramsey is having to run all over the place it nullifies his qualities. The issue is that if we don't start Ramsey and lose, 1-0 or 10-0, Page rather wrongly has petrol poured over him and set on fire. I think Ramsey will start, he's our captain and this is a huge game, I don't think he finishes the game though. |
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Post by iot on Sept 23, 2023 18:02:52 GMT
If I'm picking a team that I think is most capable of getting a result against Croatia then Rambo isn't in that, because of his characteristics & the characteristics of other players I agree with you he's our most imaginative & creative player, and he's in the best head space, and physical condition he's been in for a while But none of that means he's the correct type of player to hurt Croatia I tend to agree with this, it's the kind of game that could pass him by because his style isn't to dig in and "put a shift in" which is required in these kind of games from everyone for us right now because there's a quality gap that has to be bridged. He's our best player but it's horses for courses, not an art show. That reads quite depressingly I know but if Ramsey is having to run all over the place it nullifies his qualities. The issue is that if we don't start Ramsey and lose, 1-0 or 10-0, Page rather wrongly has petrol poured over him and set on fire. I think Ramsey will start, he's our captain and this is a huge game, I don't think he finishes the game though. I wonder how much people actually watch Ramsey play. His running stats are almost always the highest in the team. He absolutely does get stuck in. He's great off the ball as well as on it. The game against England in Euro 16 springs to mind. We were poor and they had 70% of the ball, but Ramsey was our best player. He's an ultra competitor, our leader, and best player. It would be madness not to start him against Croatia |
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