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Post by vvm on Nov 20, 2023 11:30:41 GMT
A new manager might also struggle to get a tune out of the team for the playoffs. No friendlies or camps before March so they wouldn't have a lot of opportunities to get their ideas across or implement any drastic changes.
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Post by underwood on Nov 20, 2023 11:41:00 GMT
A new manager might also struggle to get a tune out of the team for the playoffs. No friendlies or camps before March so they wouldn't have a lot of opportunities to get their ideas across or implement any drastic changes. The current manager’s ideas won’t work in the Play Offs. |
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Post by njdragon on Nov 20, 2023 12:02:33 GMT
Thought this was the Rob Page thread ? Enough, he tried, we’ve failed to qualify. Next. Asking fans on here to justify sacking Page by nominating their suggested replacement is nonsensical. It’s not our job. There are highly paid people at the FAW who should already have his replacement lined up. My point was everyone is sticking the knife in as if Page has had a terrible campaign but before the campaign did anyone expect to achieve more than the following from this group? : Croatia - 1 point Armenia - 4 points Turkey - 3 points Latvia - 6 points Total - 14 We're on track to achieve this total and in most scenarios it would be enough to qualify. Maybe others have higher expectations considering where we are but that's just me. That is too much sense for this particular page  Just had a read through when the euro group was announces and lots of realism there then - talk of us and Turkey competing for second spot. Unfortunately Turkey have just had a massive run of form. Lots mention Armenia while beatable a difficult 4th seed. Not much talk of us beating Croatia and lots of this was before we lost Bale and Allen. WIN against Turkey - Page stays, whilst not over achieving we haven't under achieved either considering the loss of our main 3 players - not many sides in the world would cope with losing their 3 best players. DRAW - he stays for the play offs and we go from there - lose in the play offs and he goes LOSE and he should step down immediately. |
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Post by jbt95 on Nov 20, 2023 12:03:09 GMT
A new manager might also struggle to get a tune out of the team for the playoffs. No friendlies or camps before March so they wouldn't have a lot of opportunities to get their ideas across or implement any drastic changes. The current manager’s ideas won’t work in the Play Offs. We won’t be changing manager before the play-offs. |
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Post by winsumluzsum on Nov 20, 2023 12:21:27 GMT
The current manager’s ideas won’t work in the Play Offs. We won’t be changing manager before the play-offs. If we lose to Turkiye then he'll probably go. Draw and it's 50-50, depending on the performance. For the FAW there is one big advantage to making the change now, and that's the availability of so many Welsh candidates: Nathan Jones, Mark Hughes, Pulis, Osian Roberts and Cameron Toshack. However, I suspect Mooney will want a big name, whoever that may be (please God not Keane). |
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Post by jbt95 on Nov 20, 2023 12:24:32 GMT
We won’t be changing manager before the play-offs. If we lose to Turkiye then he'll probably go. Draw and it's 50-50, depending on the performance. For the FAW there is one big advantage to making the change now, and that's the availability of so many Welsh candidates: Nathan Jones, Mark Hughes, Pulis, Osian Roberts and Cameron Toshack. However, I suspect Mooney will want a big name, whoever that may be (please God not Keane). I can’t see Page stepping down. It just won’t happen. |
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Post by njdragon on Nov 20, 2023 12:26:32 GMT
We won’t be changing manager before the play-offs. If we lose to Turkiye then he'll probably go. Draw and it's 50-50, depending on the performance. For the FAW there is one big advantage to making the change now, and that's the availability of so many Welsh candidates: Nathan Jones, Mark Hughes, Pulis, Osian Roberts and Cameron Toshack. However, I suspect Mooney will want a big name, whoever that may be (please God not Keane). If we lose and page goes we would need someone who knows the players and they know him, could giggs come back in on a temp basis? His trial is over is it not? |
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Post by winsumluzsum on Nov 20, 2023 12:42:30 GMT
If we lose to Turkiye then he'll probably go. Draw and it's 50-50, depending on the performance. For the FAW there is one big advantage to making the change now, and that's the availability of so many Welsh candidates: Nathan Jones, Mark Hughes, Pulis, Osian Roberts and Cameron Toshack. However, I suspect Mooney will want a big name, whoever that may be (please God not Keane). If we lose and page goes we would need someone who knows the players and they know him, could giggs come back in on a temp basis? His trial is over is it not? I'm sure it will have crossed Mooney's mind. I really hope we don't go there. |
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Post by garynysmon on Nov 20, 2023 12:44:32 GMT
My point was everyone is sticking the knife in as if Page has had a terrible campaign but before the campaign did anyone expect to achieve more than the following from this group? : Croatia - 1 point Armenia - 4 points Turkey - 3 points Latvia - 6 points Total - 14 We're on track to achieve this total and in most scenarios it would be enough to qualify. Maybe others have higher expectations considering where we are but that's just me. That is too much sense for this particular page Just had a read through when the euro group was announces and lots of realism there then - talk of us and Turkey competing for second spot. Unfortunately Turkey have just had a massive run of form. Lots mention Armenia while beatable a difficult 4th seed. Not much talk of us beating Croatia and lots of this was before we lost Bale and Allen. WIN against Turkey - Page stays, whilst not over achieving we haven't under achieved either considering the loss of our main 3 players - not many sides in the world would cope with losing their 3 best players. DRAW - he stays for the play offs and we go from there - lose in the play offs and he goes LOSE and he should step down immediately. Page is never going to resign. His stock is low, his track record at club level is poor and no club is going to clamour for his services. He knows this. |
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Post by ddirpytnop on Nov 20, 2023 12:48:30 GMT
Jordan James look way out of his depth yesterday No he didn't, he just didn't have a great game. And he didn't look out of his depth against stronger opposition in Croatia, so what's the point you're making? You can't take one example and disregard the other. He might be inconsistent, in which case it's not a case of being out of his depth. Or either game might have been an isolated exception to the rule, in which case he's possibly not consistently as good as he was against Croatia, or that he's usually better than he was v Armenia. Again not a case of being out of his depth. Or maybe he's 19, with potential but inconsistent, and we just don't know his true level yet. Again not a matter of being out of his depth, because he has performed under pressure against better opposition previously. No, he wasn't as good as he was against Croatia, but who was? It was simply not a good team performance, and he was part of that, but no better or worse than the average I'd say. It was not a performance that really showed a lack of experience or ability - it simply just wasn't great. That happens to 30 year old Premier league regulars or 19 year old Championship hopefuls. I'd go further and say that Jordan was perhaps our best player against Armenia. In the first half in particular, he was often put in trouble by poor passes into him and showed great skill and awareness in extricating himself. He faded as the second half went on - he has barely played a 90 minute match for his club and I think it showed - but he was no worse than the much more experienced Ampadu. No one suggests the latter is 'out of his depth'. (Hate that tired cliche too). |
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Post by winsumluzsum on Nov 20, 2023 13:05:23 GMT
Yes, Jordan was decent, a 6 out of 10 performance. Ampadu in contrast was poor all round. At fault for the goal, missed a good chance at the death with his head, and had poor distribution.
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Post by zserty on Nov 20, 2023 13:12:12 GMT
If we lose to Turkiye then he'll probably go. Draw and it's 50-50, depending on the performance. For the FAW there is one big advantage to making the change now, and that's the availability of so many Welsh candidates: Nathan Jones, Mark Hughes, Pulis, Osian Roberts and Cameron Toshack. However, I suspect Mooney will want a big name, whoever that may be (please God not Keane). If we lose and page goes we would need someone who knows the players and they know him, could giggs come back in on a temp basis? His trial is over is it not? God i hope we wouldn't go back to Giggs. That would be shooting ourselves in the foot tenfold. |
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Post by melynwy on Nov 20, 2023 13:13:56 GMT
My point was everyone is sticking the knife in as if Page has had a terrible campaign but before the campaign did anyone expect to achieve more than the following from this group? : Croatia - 1 point Armenia - 4 points Turkey - 3 points Latvia - 6 points Total - 14 We're on track to achieve this total and in most scenarios it would be enough to qualify. Maybe others have higher expectations considering where we are but that's just me. That is too much sense for this particular page Just had a read through when the euro group was announces and lots of realism there then - talk of us and Turkey competing for second spot. Unfortunately Turkey have just had a massive run of form. Lots mention Armenia while beatable a difficult 4th seed. Not much talk of us beating Croatia and lots of this was before we lost Bale and Allen. WIN against Turkey - Page stays, whilst not over achieving we haven't under achieved either considering the loss of our main 3 players - not many sides in the world would cope with losing their 3 best players. DRAW - he stays for the play offs and we go from there - lose in the play offs and he goes LOSE and he should step down immediately. Hmm. Who are the 3 star players that have retired? Or are you referring to Bale and Allen, and Ramsey missing the last few games with injury? |
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Post by njdragon on Nov 20, 2023 13:17:38 GMT
That is too much sense for this particular page Just had a read through when the euro group was announces and lots of realism there then - talk of us and Turkey competing for second spot. Unfortunately Turkey have just had a massive run of form. Lots mention Armenia while beatable a difficult 4th seed. Not much talk of us beating Croatia and lots of this was before we lost Bale and Allen. WIN against Turkey - Page stays, whilst not over achieving we haven't under achieved either considering the loss of our main 3 players - not many sides in the world would cope with losing their 3 best players. DRAW - he stays for the play offs and we go from there - lose in the play offs and he goes LOSE and he should step down immediately. Hmm. Who are the 3 star players that have retired? Or are you referring to Bale and Allen, and Ramsey missing the last few games with injury? joniesta, Gunter and ... Nah Bale, Allen and of course i think Rambo is gone after this tournament. He's semi retired. |
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Post by saturn9 on Nov 20, 2023 17:22:04 GMT
If we lose and page goes we would need someone who knows the players and they know him, could giggs come back in on a temp basis? His trial is over is it not? God i hope we wouldn't go back to Giggs. That would be shooting ourselves in the foot tenfold. What about the French male coach who's now in charge of France women's team?? He managed the Saudis during the last WC. Why can't we go down the route of a competent European coach?? |
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Post by rob on Nov 20, 2023 17:43:06 GMT
That is too much sense for this particular page Just had a read through when the euro group was announces and lots of realism there then - talk of us and Turkey competing for second spot. Unfortunately Turkey have just had a massive run of form. Lots mention Armenia while beatable a difficult 4th seed. Not much talk of us beating Croatia and lots of this was before we lost Bale and Allen. WIN against Turkey - Page stays, whilst not over achieving we haven't under achieved either considering the loss of our main 3 players - not many sides in the world would cope with losing their 3 best players. DRAW - he stays for the play offs and we go from there - lose in the play offs and he goes LOSE and he should step down immediately. Page is never going to resign. His stock is low, his track record at club level is poor and no club is going to clamour for his services. He knows this. This. We had 1 good performance in the group-Croatia home.The rest was poor - Croatia away being ultimate smash and grab.Page should have gone after the shambolic World Cup. |
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Post by conwy10 on Nov 20, 2023 18:33:44 GMT
Thought this was the Rob Page thread ? Enough, he tried, we’ve failed to qualify. Next. Asking fans on here to justify sacking Page by nominating their suggested replacement is nonsensical. It’s not our job. There are highly paid people at the FAW who should already have his replacement lined up. My point was everyone is sticking the knife in as if Page has had a terrible campaign but before the campaign did anyone expect to achieve more than the following from this group? : Croatia - 1 point Armenia - 4 points Turkey - 3 points Latvia - 6 points Total - 14 We're on track to achieve this total and in most scenarios it would be enough to qualify. Maybe others have higher expectations considering where we are but that's just me. The Armenia results is where he's caused an issue for himself. Points against Croatia were amazing and he deserves the credit for them... but they go alongside taking only 1 point off Armenia and it can't be ignored. The Latvia games were unconvincing, the only time we've looked good in the whole campaign was Croatia at home where we looked class. It's difficult for him as if he'd have won out in Armenia he'd be on track and it's beat Turkey and we're there despite that shocking result at home. But 2 shocking performances against a team we should be beating has cost him. |
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Post by winsumluzsum on Nov 20, 2023 19:00:38 GMT
You're still not giving Armenia the credit they deserve. Up front in particular they looked every bit as good as us, if not better, and they defended very well. Zelarayan was quite incredible, and not just with the goals. Just our luck that in his 13 internationals for Armenia he has scored 3 goals, against you know who. But the biggest difference between two fairly evenly matched sides was the coaches.
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Post by hooky on Nov 20, 2023 19:04:11 GMT
If we lose and page goes we would need someone who knows the players and they know him, could giggs come back in on a temp basis? His trial is over is it not? God i hope we wouldn't go back to Giggs. That would be shooting ourselves in the foot tenfold. We should not go back to him given his baggage but manger wise he would be a big upgrade on page |
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Post by jimmytaff on Nov 20, 2023 19:42:08 GMT
God i hope we wouldn't go back to Giggs. That would be shooting ourselves in the foot tenfold. We should not go back to him given his baggage but manger wise he would be a big upgrade on page Agreed think he's a much better coach than Page but not worth it. There would be bad PR around it and his authority possibly undermined. |
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Post by rob on Nov 20, 2023 20:05:47 GMT
A new manager might also struggle to get a tune out of the team for the playoffs. No friendlies or camps before March so they wouldn't have a lot of opportunities to get their ideas across or implement any drastic changes. Page will struggle.He always has but Bale baled him out. |
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Post by majorraglan on Nov 20, 2023 23:06:22 GMT
My point was everyone is sticking the knife in as if Page has had a terrible campaign but before the campaign did anyone expect to achieve more than the following from this group? : Croatia - 1 point Armenia - 4 points Turkey - 3 points Latvia - 6 points Total - 14 We're on track to achieve this total and in most scenarios it would be enough to qualify. Maybe others have higher expectations considering where we are but that's just me. The Armenia results is where he's caused an issue for himself. Points against Croatia were amazing and he deserves the credit for them... but they go alongside taking only 1 point off Armenia and it can't be ignored. The Latvia games were unconvincing, the only time we've looked good in the whole campaign was Croatia at home where we looked class. It's difficult for him as if he'd have won out in Armenia he'd be on track and it's beat Turkey and we're there despite that shocking result at home. But 2 shocking performances against a team we should be beating has cost him. As has been said the point in Croatia was the ultimate smash and grab, the home performance was the best I’ve seen us play in a while. Didn’t see Saturdays game, but the home match against Armenia was a terrible performance, embarrassing even - the team was poor but Page seemed lost and ineffective. The bottom line was that we had a play off place regardless of Saturdays result, so why not go for the win. The guy is a passionate Welshman, but that’s not always enough and my personal view is that his time is up. |
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Post by majorraglan on Nov 20, 2023 23:27:31 GMT
Thought this was the Rob Page thread ? Enough, he tried, we’ve failed to qualify. Next. Asking fans on here to justify sacking Page by nominating their suggested replacement is nonsensical. It’s not our job. There are highly paid people at the FAW who should already have his replacement lined up. I personally think Page will resign before the end of the week. He is a proud man & it was clear how much the situation had got to him pre-Croatia. I think it would be the right decision for him & the team. The Play Offs need a fresh approach. I think we have two short-term options, both of which involve Osian Roberts. These games will be won & lost tactically, so there is nobody better to have on board. Option 1 is for Osian to get Patrick Vieira to join us, sharing with his role at Strasbourg. Option 2 is for there to be a Management Group of Gunter, Ramsey & Bale to work with Osian. Either way, we need something different to at least change the approach in what will effectively be a bit of a lottery in the New Year, because maintaining the status quo isn’t going to get us there. Im not sold on either option to be honest. Osian Roberts possibly, but with some experienced support because he’s never done it as a Manager at this level. In terms of Viera, he didn’t do much in Palace and Strasbourg is a bit up and down. Granted it’s tight in Ligue 1but Strasbourg’s results aren’t great and they 15th out of 18 teams- albeit there’s a small number of points between 8th and 15th place. Option 2 - I’m defo not in favour of bringing Gunter, Ramsey or Bale in to a management team as they’ve no experience and in Amseys case still playing. I’m a proud passionate Welshman just like nearly everyone on here, but I just don’t get this FAW thing of going for the Welsh option, you go for the right person regardless of nationality. If you had a multi million pound business, would you put an unproven person in charge or would you go for the proven leader? |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Nov 20, 2023 23:35:07 GMT
Thought this was the Rob Page thread ? Enough, he tried, we’ve failed to qualify. Next. Asking fans on here to justify sacking Page by nominating their suggested replacement is nonsensical. It’s not our job. There are highly paid people at the FAW who should already have his replacement lined up. You absolutely should have a replacement in mind if you're suggesting sacking Page because otherwise you come across as a child throwing toys out of the pram. No one is saying you have to go out and do the appointing, but if you're going to call for a sacking you should have an idea of what the implications would be for that in my opinion If you don't then you don't want Page sacked, you just want to vent |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Nov 20, 2023 23:42:22 GMT
I personally think Page will resign before the end of the week. He is a proud man & it was clear how much the situation had got to him pre-Croatia. I think it would be the right decision for him & the team. The Play Offs need a fresh approach. I think we have two short-term options, both of which involve Osian Roberts. These games will be won & lost tactically, so there is nobody better to have on board. Option 1 is for Osian to get Patrick Vieira to join us, sharing with his role at Strasbourg. Option 2 is for there to be a Management Group of Gunter, Ramsey & Bale to work with Osian. Either way, we need something different to at least change the approach in what will effectively be a bit of a lottery in the New Year, because maintaining the status quo isn’t going to get us there. Im not sold on either option to be honest. Osian Roberts possibly, but with some experienced support because he’s never done it as a Manager at this level. In terms of Viera, he didn’t do much in Palace and Strasbourg is a bit up and down. Granted it’s tight in Ligue 1but Strasbourg’s results aren’t great and they 15th out of 18 teams- albeit there’s a small number of points between 8th and 15th place. Option 2 - I’m defo not in favour of bringing Gunter, Ramsey or Bale in to a management team as they’ve no experience and in Amseys case still playing. I’m a proud passionate Welshman just like nearly everyone on here, but I just get this FAW thing of going for the Welsh option, you go for the right person regardless of nationality. If you had a multi million pound business, would you put an unproven person in charge or would you go for the proven leader? I like that we go for Welsh managers. It's served us very well over the last 10 years, and the fact we tend to get younger cheaper managers in means that we do have refreshing ideas when someone does come in. Speed, Coleman, Giggs, Page they've all been very different and we've had periods of success under all of them Now if we had terrible options, e.g a choice of Pulis or a foreign manager, I'd say yes let's try something different. But I think Nathan Jones, Craig Bellamy, Osian Roberts are all good viable options that mean we shouldn't need to look abroad Don't forget, we are not a well-off FA, so we can't just hire anyone. Part of the pull of our national team is that we are such a passionate nation and every passionate Welshman would love to take the job |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Nov 20, 2023 23:44:52 GMT
Our results against everyone else have been good enough. It's the Armenia games that have tripped us up completely. Had we even just won the home game we'd be in a great position to qualify But if my Aunt had balls……… the facts are we HAVENT been good enough!! And a team ranked 95th in the world have had our number TWICE!! I was just commenting on your comment that we've only had 1 good result/performance. It's true that if we'd won either Armenia game we'd be in position to qualify tomorrow. I get that we didn't get those results, but if Danny Ward comes and collects that cross on Saturday we're possibly sat here all excited for qualification and you wouldn't be saying this My point is if it's such a fine line between brilliance and disaster, then perhaps we've neither been brilliant or disastrous, and just average/sub-par |
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Post by jimexotic on Nov 21, 2023 0:06:29 GMT
I've touched on this in here or on another thread, reverse that Armenia home game and we'd basically have one foot planted in Germany.
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Post by felinessex on Nov 21, 2023 0:58:01 GMT
Thought this was the Rob Page thread ? Enough, he tried, we’ve failed to qualify. Next. Asking fans on here to justify sacking Page by nominating their suggested replacement is nonsensical. It’s not our job. There are highly paid people at the FAW who should already have his replacement lined up. You absolutely should have a replacement in mind if you're suggesting sacking Page because otherwise you come across as a child throwing toys out of the pram. No one is saying you have to go out and do the appointing, but if you're going to call for a sacking you should have an idea of what the implications would be for that in my opinion If you don't then you don't want Page sacked, you just want to vent Sorry, I disagree entirely. You reckon it’s the fans task to select the next manager ? Nonsense. The FAW should be ruthlessly ambitious and any manager that doesn’t achieve qualification should be deemed to have failed in his job. Page’s World Cup selections, tactics and performances were woeful. We’ve carried on without improvement from there. I’m 100% confident that a better manager would get a far superior performance from the squad we have available. Accepting failure on the “good bloke” basis, is totally amateur football. Whoever manages us should be tasked with achieving success over a given period. Page has failed. I agree that he comes over as a “good bloke” but I want us to demand success from players and manager alike. No more acceptance of “plucky old Wales” just failing. Nice wins nothing. P.S. please don’t call me a child again because I disagree with you ! We definitely have the players who should have got us qualification from this group. I’ll say it again, Armenia away and Turkiye at home were the easiest play-off fixtures available to us. Getting to the actual play offs is not a success. I despair if we head into them with Page still in charge. Vault me if I’m proved wrong. |
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Post by erasedcitizen on Nov 21, 2023 7:24:27 GMT
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Post by kingstonred on Nov 21, 2023 9:26:06 GMT
Give it Giggsy til the the end of the season
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Just had a read through when the euro group was announces and lots of realism there then - talk of us and Turkey competing for second spot. Unfortunately Turkey have just had a massive run of form. Lots mention Armenia while beatable a difficult 4th seed. Not much talk of us beating Croatia 
