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Post by jbt95 on Sept 2, 2019 18:09:04 GMT
They have managed to keep more players than many thought. The manager also seems to have hit the ground running. Personally thought they would struggle but after this start they need to be pushing for play offs. I wonder if there will be a few quid available in January if they have a good chance of going up. No chance, we're already overstretched due to not being able to shift Borja, Ayew and a few others. We're already effectively gambling on promotion, just not by choice. Sold McBurnie and James for £30m and spent £1m? If Ayew is on 80k a week that is only £4.2m a year which would be probably what a fee would be for a replacement. |
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Post by holmesdaleultra on Sept 2, 2019 20:23:53 GMT
As a neutral wouldn't it be better if Swansea stayed in the championship this season and bring more Welsh players into the first team and get promoted next year.
Credit to Swansea for giving young Welsh players opportunities in the first team.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2019 22:41:03 GMT
No chance, we're already overstretched due to not being able to shift Borja, Ayew and a few others. We're already effectively gambling on promotion, just not by choice. Sold McBurnie and James for £30m and spent £1m? If Ayew is on 80k a week that is only £4.2m a year which would be probably what a fee would be for a replacement. Birch after the McBurnie sale: “As I’ve discussed previously, we still have a substantial financial deficit to overcome following relegation. The transfer of Dan James to Manchester United gave us breathing space, as did Jordan Ayew’s move to Crystal Palace from a wage perspective, but we still have some way to go to get this club back on a sound financial footing." The deficit doesn't disappear just because we cashed a couple of cheques. Every month we lose more money while the wage bill as as high as it is. Our owners wanted Dan James out in January to recover losses/debts already incurred that season. It wasn't cash to spend in the future, it was needed to patch existing holes. And we already "replaced" Ayew (who wasn't with us last season so why would he need replacing?) with Peterson and Kalulu, who must be wondering why they came in. Kalulu's been injured but I doubt either imagined they wouldn't even be involved in matchday squads at this point, behind Celina, Ayew, Dyer, Routs and Garrick for spots on the wings. A fair bit cheaper than £4m at least. |
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Post by jbt95 on Sept 4, 2019 17:21:40 GMT
Sold McBurnie and James for £30m and spent £1m? If Ayew is on 80k a week that is only £4.2m a year which would be probably what a fee would be for a replacement. And we already "replaced" Ayew (who wasn't with us last season so why would he need replacing?) Ayew for Dan James Borja for Oli McBurnie The other players will probably turn out to be like Barry McKay. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2019 21:19:41 GMT
Another 11 young Welsh players (if you include Tivonge Rushesha) representing Swansea's u23s tonight following the sudden departures of managers Cameron Toshack and Gary Richards to Pafos in Cyprus. 1-1 draw with Villa, u21 international Brandon Cooper scoring the Swansea goal. Form and performances have stabilised a bit after a very poor run.
Tough times in the academy. Matt Jones also finished as u16s manager in the last week. A category downgrade must be around the corner. Not nearly enough players at the club - or money available to spend on recruitment - to justify it any more.
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Post by manulike on Dec 18, 2019 22:41:07 GMT
Congrats to these (very) young Swans ;-)
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Post by barry on Dec 18, 2019 23:33:18 GMT
That tweet needs a few more hashtags.
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Post by manulike on Dec 19, 2019 21:34:23 GMT
That tweet needs a few more hashtags. #Yes.They.Can |
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Post by marsvolta on Dec 19, 2019 21:55:45 GMT
Another 11 young Welsh players (if you include Tivonge Rushesha) representing Swansea's u23s tonight following the sudden departures of managers Cameron Toshack and Gary Richards to Pafos in Cyprus. 1-1 draw with Villa, u21 international Brandon Cooper scoring the Swansea goal. Form and performances have stabilised a bit after a very poor run. Tough times in the academy. Matt Jones also finished as u16s manager in the last week. A category downgrade must be around the corner. Not nearly enough players at the club - or money available to spend on recruitment - to justify it any more. Why wouldn’t you count Tivonge Rushesha? |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2019 22:34:52 GMT
Another 11 young Welsh players (if you include Tivonge Rushesha) representing Swansea's u23s tonight following the sudden departures of managers Cameron Toshack and Gary Richards to Pafos in Cyprus. 1-1 draw with Villa, u21 international Brandon Cooper scoring the Swansea goal. Form and performances have stabilised a bit after a very poor run. Tough times in the academy. Matt Jones also finished as u16s manager in the last week. A category downgrade must be around the corner. Not nearly enough players at the club - or money available to spend on recruitment - to justify it any more. Why wouldn’t you count Tivonge Rushesha? Because he was called up by Zimbabwe's senior squad for their last round of qualifiers but didn't go because he was injured (plus there was fuss about getting his passport renewed in time, as with many other EFL players, although Tivonge didn't need a completely new one so it sounded like there was no major problem there). He was called up by Wales u19s in the same international break so it's still up in the air as to whether he chooses to represent his nation of birth (Zimbabwe) or the nation in which he has been raised (Wales). I suspect the former will win out. |
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Post by marsvolta on Dec 20, 2019 3:42:20 GMT
Why wouldn’t you count Tivonge Rushesha? Because he was called up by Zimbabwe's senior squad for their last round of qualifiers but didn't go because he was injured (plus there was fuss about getting his passport renewed in time, as with many other EFL players, although Tivonge didn't need a completely new one so it sounded like there was no major problem there). He was called up by Wales u19s in the same international break so it's still up in the air as to whether he chooses to represent his nation of birth (Zimbabwe) or the nation in which he has been raised (Wales). I suspect the former will win out. Oh wow, didn’t know this. Thanks. |
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Post by aberbeeg on Jan 23, 2020 19:00:41 GMT
Sad to read that Swansea have sold their training facilities and have moved out of Merthyr and Cardiff with their Acadamy.
it means they drop from level 1 to level 3 for their academy status.Reports suggest the Club have a 40 million shortfall in finances and the Yanks are asset stripping and have refused to put any more money into the Club.
its promotion or bust it seems this season. Sad times ahead for another Welsh Club/Welsh football
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Post by walesgolfmadrid on Jan 23, 2020 19:26:47 GMT
Well I hardly think it's promotion or bust, as that's not the approach that the club is going for.
I don't think it means we're in any worse of a financial position than the one we all knew we were in, it's just another part of the move away from expenditure that's happened in all other aspects for the club.
Very few Championship clubs are Category 1 clubs, it's just the level we're at. We aren't in a different situation to the one every one knew we've been in since relegation.
In reality it's actually looking a lot better for us financially then it was 18 months ago. We've closed the gap with player sales, and are now only four or five months away from most of our higher earners contracts expiring which will see us in a much healthier position financially and should allow us to spend at least a couple of million a year.
It's Cardiff really that have had a bad couple of months financially if anyone, given that they're going to have to find £15 million from somewhere that I expect they don't really have spare.
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Post by evans1282 on Jan 23, 2020 20:04:47 GMT
Losing category one is vital for Wales though ,look how Cardiff's production line ground to a halt after it was reduced
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Post by bracklablue72 on Jan 23, 2020 21:24:32 GMT
Well I hardly think it's promotion or bust, as that's not the approach that the club is going for. I don't think it means we're in any worse of a financial position than the one we all knew we were in, it's just another part of the move away from expenditure that's happened in all other aspects for the club. Very few Championship clubs are Category 1 clubs, it's just the level we're at. We aren't in a different situation to the one every one knew we've been in since relegation. In reality it's actually looking a lot better for us financially then it was 18 months ago. We've closed the gap with player sales, and are now only four or five months away from most of our higher earners contracts expiring which will see us in a much healthier position financially and should allow us to spend at least a couple of million a year. It's Cardiff really that have had a bad couple of months financially if anyone, given that they're going to have to find £15 million from somewhere that I expect they don't really have spare. £15m? Explain.... |
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Post by aberbeeg on Jan 24, 2020 8:08:21 GMT
Well I hardly think it's promotion or bust, as that's not the approach that the club is going for. I don't think it means we're in any worse of a financial position than the one we all knew we were in, it's just another part of the move away from expenditure that's happened in all other aspects for the club. Very few Championship clubs are Category 1 clubs, it's just the level we're at. We aren't in a different situation to the one every one knew we've been in since relegation. In reality it's actually looking a lot better for us financially then it was 18 months ago. We've closed the gap with player sales, and are now only four or five months away from most of our higher earners contracts expiring which will see us in a much healthier position financially and should allow us to spend at least a couple of million a year. It's Cardiff really that have had a bad couple of months financially if anyone, given that they're going to have to find £15 million from somewhere that I expect they don't really have spare. I think that both clubs are not in great position but Cardiff do own their stadium which goes a long way to actually earning some money and is a huge asset on the balance sheets.Plus Cardiff have a Billionaire owner. It does look like the Yanks are asset stripping Swansea for their hedge funds and will need to keep selling ( players and any remaining assets). The lose of cat 1 academy is certainly not great for either the Swans or Welsh football. It makes things a lot easier for other Cat 1 clubs to poach the youngsters ( remember Motando being poached from Cardiff to Man City then sold on for 10 million). |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2020 10:16:50 GMT
Nothing has been sold and the plan is to remain Cat 1 according to Trevor Birch at the fans forum yesterday.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2020 10:28:16 GMT
Well I hardly think it's promotion or bust, as that's not the approach that the club is going for. I don't think it means we're in any worse of a financial position than the one we all knew we were in, it's just another part of the move away from expenditure that's happened in all other aspects for the club. Very few Championship clubs are Category 1 clubs, it's just the level we're at. We aren't in a different situation to the one every one knew we've been in since relegation. In reality it's actually looking a lot better for us financially then it was 18 months ago. We've closed the gap with player sales, and are now only four or five months away from most of our higher earners contracts expiring which will see us in a much healthier position financially and should allow us to spend at least a couple of million a year. It's Cardiff really that have had a bad couple of months financially if anyone, given that they're going to have to find £15 million from somewhere that I expect they don't really have spare. I think that both clubs are not in great position but Cardiff do own their stadium which goes a long way to actually earning some money and is a huge asset on the balance sheets.Plus Cardiff have a Billionaire owner. It does look like the Yanks are asset stripping Swansea for their hedge funds There's no indication that they have been taking money out of the club so accusations of "asset-stripping" are nonsense as well. Players were sold because relegation meant annual income dropped from £120m to ~£60m last season alone, and keeps dropping (will be ~£15m when parachute payments run out). We've got Andre Ayew earning £4m plus tax and bonuses every year so bills need paying. We had the highest % wage spend to turnover in the PL when we were relegated, £90m+ wage bill in our final season (survival bonuses would have taken it over £100m). Paying £4-5m a year for Cat 1 simply to prevent poaching is a waste of money. You'd have to prevent the loss of a Matondo every 2-3 years just to justify it on those grounds. And aren't Cat 1 Man Utd supposedly going to pay £30m for Jude Bellingham from Cat 2 Birmingham City? Shows good players don't always get poached and I'm not sure he even has a pro deal there yet. |
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Post by iot on Jan 24, 2020 11:51:36 GMT
I can't say I understand all that much about the merits of different category levels at youth academies, but surely it can't be a coincidence that since the swans upgraded to Category 1 the likes of dan james, mcburnie, rodon, roberts, and cabango have come through? Swansea may or may not be better off downgrading their academy status (although they did turn over £30m+ last summer from selling their academy graduates), but it seems to me that Wales would certainly be worse off.
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Post by alarch on Jan 24, 2020 12:26:47 GMT
I can't say I understand all that much about the merits of different category levels at youth academies, but surely it can't be a coincidence that since the swans upgraded to Category 1 the likes of dan james, mcburnie, rodon, roberts, and cabango have come through? Swansea may or may not be better off downgrading their academy status (although they did turn over £30m+ last summer from selling their academy graduates), but it seems to me that Wales would certainly be worse off. It seems that only outsiders have such a common sense overview of the situation. I'm amazed how many Swansea fans, even the more knowledgeable ones, seem to accept the downgrading of the academy as if it's completely inconsequential. The obvious starting point in any discussion of the viability of the academy is does it generate more income in player sales than it costs on an on-going basis? The £32 million (before add-ons kick in, which I would imagine will be happening pretty soon, if not already with Dan James) generated by the sales of Dan James and McBurnie covers the reputed £4 million cost of the academy for 8 years. 8 years! It doesn't take a mathematical genius to work out that that is a pretty spectacular return on investment. And even though it will be hard to reproduce that level of return year-on-year, the likes of Rodon could well leave for £20 million or so, and Roberts for anywhere up to £10 million (although I think he will need to good Euros to realise his true value, as he's being made to look worse than he is at the moment). That's before you consider the likes of Cabango, Cooper and Garrick, who have all played this season, and behind them Cullen and Jack Evans, as well as many lesser lights. Even if these players do not command significant fees when sold, they are likely to make a contribution on the playing side of things, and at lower wages than any seasoned pros brought into the club - presumably on frees. The economic case for downgrading the academy is very weak, and is an outcome that would be bad for club and country. If you look at the nationality of the U23s and U18s this season, a majority, or even the vast majority, are Welsh qualified. You only have to look at the glut of highly talented English youngsters that are emerging, over-spilling into the continent, to realise the value of the academy system. Wales needs Swansea (and Cardiff) to make the most of that potential. |
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Post by quetzal on Jan 24, 2020 13:00:18 GMT
Sounds like a disaster for Welsh football and the Swans. Shame
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2020 14:40:21 GMT
I can't say I understand all that much about the merits of different category levels at youth academies, but surely it can't be a coincidence that since the swans upgraded to Category 1 the likes of dan james, mcburnie, rodon, roberts, and cabango have come through? Swansea may or may not be better off downgrading their academy status (although they did turn over £30m+ last summer from selling their academy graduates), but it seems to me that Wales would certainly be worse off. As someone who has spent a great deal of time reading into what the EPPP system actually does, I can tell you that the main reason we developed those players had little to do with the youth category. The category 1 system is a contributor, but only a small factor the overall circumstances. It's a set of minimum standards, entry into specific competitions (some of which we have already lost due to not being in the PL any more) and some poaching rights that we are unlikely to use going forward as we're skint, and some we never used at all that I'm aware of (unrestricted recruitment of players aged 12-15 from outside our catchment area - not in Welsh football's interest anyway, is it?) Oli McBurnie was signed as a 19 year old with senior games under his belt. He spent a couple of seasons playing PL2 football (a benefit of Cat 1) while going out on loans to EFL clubs for experience. Joe Rodon was a full professional and Connor Roberts had played a full season at Yeovil before we gained Cat 1 status. Cabango and DJ came into our setup at 16 (the latter when we were still Cat 2), and spent a lot of time progressing through the ranks. The main reason we've produced this recent glut of players is relegation suddenly providing the opportunities for advancement, and in the case of the big sales it was investment into players (for six-figure sums apiece) that has reaped long-term rewards. Oli was one of half a dozen or so Scots we bought for hundreds of grand each, and DJ's tribunal fee was something like £72k up front but with performance clauses was well beyond that when he departed. There were a lot of duds along the way, but we got a few good players out of those millions. Facilities and coaching hours are significant for the younger age groups, which will have had an effect on local lads like Jack Evans, Brandon Cooper and Liam Cullen, certainly. Category standards are minimums, though, and were always overstaffed for them while we could afford it (summer redundancies mean we're probably operating at the minimums now, where PL academies are absolutely not, and players/parents/agents will absolutely know that). |
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Post by walesgolfmadrid on Jan 24, 2020 14:43:00 GMT
Well I hardly think it's promotion or bust, as that's not the approach that the club is going for. I don't think it means we're in any worse of a financial position than the one we all knew we were in, it's just another part of the move away from expenditure that's happened in all other aspects for the club. Very few Championship clubs are Category 1 clubs, it's just the level we're at. We aren't in a different situation to the one every one knew we've been in since relegation. In reality it's actually looking a lot better for us financially then it was 18 months ago. We've closed the gap with player sales, and are now only four or five months away from most of our higher earners contracts expiring which will see us in a much healthier position financially and should allow us to spend at least a couple of million a year. It's Cardiff really that have had a bad couple of months financially if anyone, given that they're going to have to find £15 million from somewhere that I expect they don't really have spare. I think that both clubs are not in great position but Cardiff do own their stadium which goes a long way to actually earning some money and is a huge asset on the balance sheets.Plus Cardiff have a Billionaire owner. It does look like the Yanks are asset stripping Swansea for their hedge funds and will need to keep selling ( players and any remaining assets). The lose of cat 1 academy is certainly not great for either the Swans or Welsh football. It makes things a lot easier for other Cat 1 clubs to poach the youngsters ( remember Motando being poached from Cardiff to Man City then sold on for 10 million). It's nothing new though, we know we don't own the stadium, and never did when we were in a really good financial position. It makes it harder to recruit players further away from home, but for Welsh football that makes little difference as Matondo is still in good hands. There's no difference in coaching or facilities, and whilst it's hardly a good thing, it's not like we're in a really bad position. We're in the position every other Championship side is in with regards to academy status. |
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Post by walesgolfmadrid on Jan 24, 2020 14:53:57 GMT
Well I hardly think it's promotion or bust, as that's not the approach that the club is going for. I don't think it means we're in any worse of a financial position than the one we all knew we were in, it's just another part of the move away from expenditure that's happened in all other aspects for the club. Very few Championship clubs are Category 1 clubs, it's just the level we're at. We aren't in a different situation to the one every one knew we've been in since relegation. In reality it's actually looking a lot better for us financially then it was 18 months ago. We've closed the gap with player sales, and are now only four or five months away from most of our higher earners contracts expiring which will see us in a much healthier position financially and should allow us to spend at least a couple of million a year. It's Cardiff really that have had a bad couple of months financially if anyone, given that they're going to have to find £15 million from somewhere that I expect they don't really have spare. £15m? Explain.... They owe £10 million for Sala, and another £5 million next January. They're currently appealing it, but if they don't comply after the appeal then they'll have a transfer ban. |
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Post by alarch on Jan 24, 2020 16:10:14 GMT
I can't say I understand all that much about the merits of different category levels at youth academies, but surely it can't be a coincidence that since the swans upgraded to Category 1 the likes of dan james, mcburnie, rodon, roberts, and cabango have come through? Swansea may or may not be better off downgrading their academy status (although they did turn over £30m+ last summer from selling their academy graduates), but it seems to me that Wales would certainly be worse off. As someone who has spent a great deal of time reading into what the EPPP system actually does, I can tell you that the main reason we developed those players had little to do with the youth category. The category 1 system is a contributor, but only a small factor the overall circumstances. It's a set of minimum standards, entry into specific competitions (some of which we have already lost due to not being in the PL any more) and some poaching rights that we are unlikely to use going forward as we're skint, and some we never used at all that I'm aware of (unrestricted recruitment of players aged 12-15 from outside our catchment area - not in Welsh football's interest anyway, is it?) Oli McBurnie was signed as a 19 year old with senior games under his belt. He spent a couple of seasons playing PL2 football (a benefit of Cat 1) while going out on loans to EFL clubs for experience. Joe Rodon was a full professional and Connor Roberts had played a full season at Yeovil before we gained Cat 1 status. Cabango and DJ came into our setup at 16 (the latter when we were still Cat 2), and spent a lot of time progressing through the ranks. The main reason we've produced this recent glut of players is relegation suddenly providing the opportunities for advancement, and in the case of the big sales it was investment into players (for six-figure sums apiece) that has reaped long-term rewards. Oli was one of half a dozen or so Scots we bought for hundreds of grand each, and DJ's tribunal fee was something like £72k up front but with performance clauses was well beyond that when he departed. There were a lot of duds along the way, but we got a few good players out of those millions. Facilities and coaching hours are significant for the younger age groups, which will have had an effect on local lads like Jack Evans, Brandon Cooper and Liam Cullen, certainly. Category standards are minimums, though, and were always overstaffed for them while we could afford it (summer redundancies mean we're probably operating at the minimums now, where PL academies are absolutely not, and players/parents/agents will absolutely know that). You make a number of good, well informed points jaspert, but I'm not clear what conclusions you draw from them. There is a big picture here - and that's the fact that the academy is now delivering after an inevitable lead in time, given that a player entering an academy at age 8 is going to take a decade to appear in the first team, probably closer to 15 years to bring a return on investment in terms of income from a sale, and nearer 20 years to reach their peak. Swansea are through the worst of the financial pain of building the infrastructure and the worst of the lead time in bringing players through. To my mind now would be the worst time to downgrade the academy - not least because a Cat 1 academy that's providing an active pathway for players, and a manager who has a reputation in developing youth, is going to be an attractive proposition to the Dan James' of this world, playing for a Cat 3 or 2 academy, as Hull's was when Swansea poached him. If Swansea haven't got the money to recruit academy players from elsewhere for now that's not ideal - but downgrading, especially to a Cat 3 will see Swansea losing it's best prospects, in the same manner as Emyr Huws/Matondo were poached by Man City, and Swansea poached Dan James. The reported annual running cost of £4 million is small set against the realistic proceeds, so the business case for retaining Cat 1 status is very strong. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2020 16:43:24 GMT
As someone who has spent a great deal of time reading into what the EPPP system actually does, I can tell you that the main reason we developed those players had little to do with the youth category. The category 1 system is a contributor, but only a small factor the overall circumstances. It's a set of minimum standards, entry into specific competitions (some of which we have already lost due to not being in the PL any more) and some poaching rights that we are unlikely to use going forward as we're skint, and some we never used at all that I'm aware of (unrestricted recruitment of players aged 12-15 from outside our catchment area - not in Welsh football's interest anyway, is it?) Oli McBurnie was signed as a 19 year old with senior games under his belt. He spent a couple of seasons playing PL2 football (a benefit of Cat 1) while going out on loans to EFL clubs for experience. Joe Rodon was a full professional and Connor Roberts had played a full season at Yeovil before we gained Cat 1 status. Cabango and DJ came into our setup at 16 (the latter when we were still Cat 2), and spent a lot of time progressing through the ranks. The main reason we've produced this recent glut of players is relegation suddenly providing the opportunities for advancement, and in the case of the big sales it was investment into players (for six-figure sums apiece) that has reaped long-term rewards. Oli was one of half a dozen or so Scots we bought for hundreds of grand each, and DJ's tribunal fee was something like £72k up front but with performance clauses was well beyond that when he departed. There were a lot of duds along the way, but we got a few good players out of those millions. Facilities and coaching hours are significant for the younger age groups, which will have had an effect on local lads like Jack Evans, Brandon Cooper and Liam Cullen, certainly. Category standards are minimums, though, and were always overstaffed for them while we could afford it (summer redundancies mean we're probably operating at the minimums now, where PL academies are absolutely not, and players/parents/agents will absolutely know that). You make a number of good, well informed points jaspert, but I'm not clear what conclusions you draw from them. There is a big picture here - and that's the fact that the academy is now delivering after an inevitable lead in time, given that a player entering an academy at age 8 is going to take a decade to appear in the first team, probably closer to 15 years to bring a return on investment in terms of income from a sale, and nearer 20 years to reach their peak. Swansea are through the worst of the financial pain of building the infrastructure and the worst of the lead time in bringing players through. To my mind now would be the worst time to downgrade the academy - not least because a Cat 1 academy that's providing an active pathway for players, and a manager who has a reputation in developing youth, is going to be an attractive proposition to the Dan James' of this world, playing for a Cat 3 or 2 academy, as Hull's was when Swansea poached him. If Swansea haven't got the money to recruit academy players from elsewhere for now that's not ideal - but downgrading, especially to a Cat 3 will see Swansea losing it's best prospects, in the same manner as Emyr Huws/Matondo were poached by Man City, and Swansea poached Dan James. The reported annual running cost of £4 million is small set against the realistic proceeds, so the business case for retaining Cat 1 status is very strong. The threat of players being poached is continually overstated. Leeds, Sheff Utd, Bristol, Birmingham... these clubs are producing quality players in the Championship without Cat 1 protections. You may lose one or two but working well with what you have will always produce results, especially when you can demonstrate an active pathway to future prospects. Running costs of £4m a year are not exactly small against "realistic proceeds" of producing a £10-15m player every few years (with no guarantee, and then having to sell to keep the operation in the black). The drop to the Championship and removal of what Potter called the glass ceiling to progression that the PL represented led to a volume of players stepping up all at once that won't be repeated in the near future. The business case isn't great when you consider we spent ~£800k on interest on cashflow loans on the last accounts - the club does not have the spare capital to freely invest in long term projects that could as you say only pay off a decade from now. Debt will spiral, as it has with so many clubs, and we don't have owners who will shoulder £150m of debt like Mike Ashley and the betting company scum at Stoke have. Nor are we profitable enough to shoulder the burden of massive debts like the Man Utds of the world. Nothing more expensive than buying money. Cat 1 is nice to aspire to and it is good for player development, but losing it is by no means the end of the road for Swansea City to produce Welsh footballers, and the day may come when the decision is made for the good of the football club as a whole. The EPPP standards were not written to be a guide for academies to make money and be profitable, they are an attempt to drive up standards of coaching, education, welfare etc. among academies in English football by offering the clubs with the means to do so added incentives for recruitment. Their stated aim is for England to produce more and better players than before. It's a mistake to approach a complex issue with a mindset of higher category = better players = more profits. |
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Post by alarch on Jan 24, 2020 17:23:59 GMT
The running costs of £4 million a year when set against the running costs of about £2 million a year for a typical Cat 2 academy isn't that big a difference, especially when you factor in the fact that Cat 1 academies attract a greater level of funding. I also don't see at all why it's unrealistic to expect an average of at least £4 million a year in profits from academy player sales to cover the costs of the academy - as well of course as providing low wage cost players for the 1st team.
The conveyor belt is now in place, some years will be very fruitful, others less so, but at least you have a realistic prospect of the club punching above it's weight. The only other way is the Brentford way, which relies on a lot of in-house analytics expertise to spot talent elsewhere, at academy and at senior level. Brentford have that expertise right to the top of the club, seeing that that is how Matthew Benham made his fortune. The same can hardly be said of Swansea, nor the vast majority of clubs for that matter. Their success will be difficult to emulate elsewhere.
I'll grant you that reducing the status to Cat 2 might work almost as well - but it's a big risk for a modest financial saving. If Swansea are still in the Championship in a couple of season's time, and the well of talent from the academy is drying up, that might be the time to re-appraise the status of the academy. Right now it smacks of short-termism of the worst kind, and owners who know the price of everything and the value of nothing.
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Post by walesgolfmadrid on Jan 24, 2020 17:34:08 GMT
The running costs of £4 million a year when set against the running costs of about £2 million a year for a typical Cat 2 academy isn't that big a difference, especially when you factor in the fact that Cat 1 academies attract a greater level of funding. I also don't see at all why it's unrealistic to expect an average of at least £4 million a year in profits from academy player sales to cover the costs of the academy - as well of course as providing low wage cost players for the 1st team. The conveyor belt is now in place, some years will be very fruitful, others less so, but at least you have a realistic prospect of the club punching above it's weight. The only other way is the Brentford way, which relies on a lot of in-house analytics expertise to spot talent elsewhere, at academy and at senior level. Brentford have that expertise right to the top of the club, seeing that that is how Matthew Benham made his fortune. The same can hardly be said of Swansea, nor the vast majority of clubs for that matter. Their success will be difficult to emulate elsewhere. I'll grant you that reducing the status to Cat 2 might work almost as well - but it's a big risk for a modest financial saving. If Swansea are still in the Championship in a couple of season's time, and the well of talent from the academy is drying up, that might be the time to re-appraise the status of the academy. Right now it smacks of short-termism of the worst kind, and owners who know the price of everything and the value of nothing. We wouldn't be reducing to Category 2 though, we'd be reducing to Category 3 which would be significantly cheaper. I also don't think it necessarily is all that related to production of youth, the Swans are currently reliant of Freddie Woodman of Category 3 Newcastle's academy. It'd most likely mean the Swans would start loaning out the likes of Cooper, Evans and Cullen sooner. |
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Post by barry on Jan 24, 2020 17:38:16 GMT
but it seems to me that Wales would certainly be worse off. I think you're right. So I'd like to see the FAW contributing to the running of it. A couple of million a year, say. I'm sure other Welsh clubs and their followers would see the merit in this. |
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Post by CrackityJones on Jan 24, 2020 17:46:13 GMT
but it seems to me that Wales would certainly be worse off. I think you're right. So I'd like to see the FAW should contributing to the running of it. A couple of million a year, say. I'm sure other Welsh clubs and their followers would see the merit in this. Haha nice try |
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