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Post by jimexotic on Feb 12, 2023 13:53:40 GMT
Should’ve stayed at Luton For the second time. |
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Post by adecolley on Feb 14, 2023 15:29:18 GMT
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Post by iot on Feb 14, 2023 15:52:51 GMT
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Post by robin1864 on Feb 15, 2023 13:54:02 GMT
Despite the fact I still think he's an unpleasant guy, he's been sounding on the verge of some sort of breakdown recently. Maybe the pressure was too much for him, and in turn, his ego couldn't handle it. I thought this, too. It's like seeing Trump Kanye or recently Will Smith bleat on about how they're "the best", when everything objective says otherwise. |
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Post by iot on Feb 15, 2023 14:10:24 GMT
Yeah, the insights from Ash on his time at Stoke would suggest that - that the higher the pyramid he climbed, the more awe-struck, intimidated and insecure he became, which is possibly part of the reason he had such contrasting outcomes at Luton, Stoke, and Southampton.
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Post by garynysmon on Feb 15, 2023 14:12:03 GMT
He's done nothing to change my opinion on religious people tbh...
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Post by dai on Feb 15, 2023 14:14:10 GMT
Religious?
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Post by garynysmon on Feb 15, 2023 14:59:24 GMT
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Post by insertname on Feb 15, 2023 15:30:48 GMT
I think what’s being lost in the conversation about Jones is that the main reason he failed is because their squad is shit. They’re being steadily downgraded in quality and whilst I don’t like the bloke’s character I do feel sorry for Jones in that the mockery of him was instantaneous. He never had a chance because of all the big names Southampton fans felt they deserved when really they could have Carlo Ancelotti in charge and they will still go down because the squad is garbage.
I have a feeling that time will make Jones’s tenure there look a lot better when the next guy through the door fails just as spectacularly. It still doesn’t change the fact that Jones committed career suicide by going there. God knows who will take him now on as failing at Southampton isn’t a negative in the grand scheme of things but the side of his personality that he revealed in that time will not be looked on favourably.
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Post by iot on Feb 15, 2023 15:55:19 GMT
Don't fully agree with that, I think there are many worse sides that have stayed up. He lost 7 of 8 league games I think? He had zero new manager bounce - the opposite in fact, with his record much worse than his predecessor. You just know that someone like Dyche would have had much better results with that same group of players. The evidence from his time at Stoke, where he was given several more months that amounted to nothing but a few false dawns (similar to his result v Man City with Southampton), would imply that he wouldn't have turned things around.
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Post by insertname on Feb 15, 2023 18:35:52 GMT
Don't fully agree with that, I think there are many worse sides that have stayed up. He lost 7 of 8 league games I think? He had zero new manager bounce - the opposite in fact, with his record much worse than his predecessor. You just know that someone like Dyche would have had much better results with that same group of players. The evidence from his time at Stoke, where he was given several more months that amounted to nothing but a few false dawns (similar to his result v Man City with Southampton), would imply that he wouldn't have turned things around. It was definitely right to get rid of him, my point is that whether they hired Jones in the first place or not they’re still overwhelmingly likely to go down. They’ve got too many kids. It seemed to all start with them hiring that Man City scout and giving him a position of influence over transfers resulting in them hoovering up the scraps of Man City’s youth team and other assorted youngsters and expecting them to hit the ground running. When I’ve seen them up front they’ve been shocking- their players constantly make the wrong decision and butcher opportunities to build a platform in the final third. Not to mention still relying on Che Adams as one of their main goal scorers. Dyche would have been as best an appointment as they could make, granted, but even he is not a miracle worker, which is what Southampton need to have any chance of staying up. |
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Post by jimexotic on Feb 15, 2023 19:31:58 GMT
Part of me thought that beating Everton would be the turning point but they're just crap. The owners deserve everything that's happening and they deserved the comedy that Jones brought during his two months or so (there were 5 weeks of no football). Season after season Southampton's business model has been to sell and replace with inferior to vastly inferior players in the hope that they'd eventually improve but they've rode their luck for too long. They haven't needed to sell like they have but they did it out of greed and lack of ambition and this is what happens when you combine those two things.
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Post by insertname on Feb 15, 2023 21:09:30 GMT
They seemed pretty well run back in the days when that Liebherr bloke bought them. Since his daughter sold up they’ve had two owners that have been winding the club down and it’s got to the point where it’s seemingly inevitable that it’s going to result in relegation
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Post by conwy10 on Feb 17, 2023 12:37:48 GMT
Yeah, the insights from Ash on his time at Stoke would suggest that - that the higher the pyramid he climbed, the more awe-struck, intimidated and insecure he became, which is possibly part of the reason he had such contrasting outcomes at Luton, Stoke, and Southampton. I can kind of see the other side to this. If he came in and said "I'm going to teach you how to play" they probably would have thought gk back to Luton with that attitude. He was working with international footballers and might have been trying to find a balance between Shawcross and Williams styles. Whilst it might not have been the right approach for them it's certainly worked for him at Luton. It is bizarre when I hear Williams say he could adapt to whatever Jones told him to do on the pitch but not to his management style. |
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Post by iot on Feb 17, 2023 13:33:38 GMT
Think the main point he was trying to make is that Jones didn't set out a way of playing, rather than he didn't teach them how to play football. Every side needs to know how they're set up and what the gameplan is - Ash is suggesting that Jones was too intimidated to do that.
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Post by insertname on Mar 1, 2023 22:09:57 GMT
O/T for Welsh football but I had to get this off my chest cus it’s been winding me up for a while….
…So I can’t stand Jones, he rubs me up the wrong way but even so the bloke deserved a chance at Southampton and yet there was an almost Jeremy Corbyn-esque character assassination from their fans before the bloke had even got through the door. His experience at Luton was obviously nowhere near good enough for them because he had no experience of a relegation battle and they hated him from day one. Yet bizarrely they threw their intellectually mediocre weight behind the guy who was part of the previous two failing regimes and, like Jones, had no relegation battle experience. The only thing the bloke had going for him was a win against a dog**** Chelsea who are arguably in an even worse place than Grimsby right now.
And so they have been proper found out for the crap they were all along. As I said upthread: they can change the manager all they like, no-one is keeping this lot up. I’m hoping for a huge mea culpa from their arsehole supporters towards Jones after all the crap he took from them about being a clown, but I won’t be holding my breath.
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Post by underwood on Mar 2, 2023 3:52:15 GMT
Ironically he’s probably one of the better options for the top end of the Championship, which is exactly where Southampton will be in 12 months from now.
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Post by marsvolta on Mar 2, 2023 6:22:58 GMT
I think Jones’ best/only chance of another stab at the Premiership is if he gets a club promoter himself. That way he’d have at least a little credit in the bank to implement his style and tactics before the inevitable pressure starts
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Post by insertname on Mar 2, 2023 10:44:56 GMT
Well maybe that’s the thing to come out of this is that people will now see that for all the unfair mockery of him it was the club itself that was largely the problem all along. I guess Jones problem more than anything is that his brand is damaged with those awful interviews he gave.
Either way, like I say no time for the bloke as a person but it’s proper wound me up the way he was mocked from the off only for them to think they were getting the next Arteta by appointing the bloke who had been a key part of previous failures.
Be interesting to see at what level Jones pops up next. Newly promoted championship sort of side I expect.
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Post by dai on Mar 2, 2023 11:31:35 GMT
O/T for Welsh football but I had to get this off my chest cus it’s been winding me up for a while…. …So I can’t stand Jones, he rubs me up the wrong way but even so the bloke deserved a chance at Southampton and yet there was an almost Jeremy Corbyn-esque character assassination from their fans before the bloke had even got through the door. His experience at Luton was obviously nowhere near good enough for them because he had no experience of a relegation battle and they hated him from day one. Yet bizarrely they threw their intellectually mediocre weight behind the guy who was part of the previous two failing regimes and, like Jones, had no relegation battle experience. The only thing the bloke had going for him was a win against a dog**** Chelsea who are arguably in an even worse place than Grimsby right now. And so they have been proper found out for the crap they were all along. As I said upthread: they can change the manager all they like, no-one is keeping this lot up. I’m hoping for a huge mea culpa from their arsehole supporters towards Jones after all the crap he took from them about being a clown, but I won’t be holding my breath. I think he's a but of k*ob, but I also think he's received a lot of abuse purely based on the fact he's Welsh. There's been a growing trend of Xenophobia within British towards the Welsh for a number of years. Off the back of our Euro success perhaps? D James while at man utd, Neco at L'pool, Joe Allen at L'pool, Ben Davies at Tottenham have all been singled out or made scapegoats a number of times. Bale has also been the subject of jokes and abuse at the hands of English fans for years. |
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Post by insertname on Mar 2, 2023 11:58:59 GMT
O/T for Welsh football but I had to get this off my chest cus it’s been winding me up for a while…. …So I can’t stand Jones, he rubs me up the wrong way but even so the bloke deserved a chance at Southampton and yet there was an almost Jeremy Corbyn-esque character assassination from their fans before the bloke had even got through the door. His experience at Luton was obviously nowhere near good enough for them because he had no experience of a relegation battle and they hated him from day one. Yet bizarrely they threw their intellectually mediocre weight behind the guy who was part of the previous two failing regimes and, like Jones, had no relegation battle experience. The only thing the bloke had going for him was a win against a dog**** Chelsea who are arguably in an even worse place than Grimsby right now. And so they have been proper found out for the crap they were all along. As I said upthread: they can change the manager all they like, no-one is keeping this lot up. I’m hoping for a huge mea culpa from their arsehole supporters towards Jones after all the crap he took from them about being a clown, but I won’t be holding my breath. I think he's a but of k*ob, but I also think he's received a lot of abuse purely based on the fact he's Welsh. There's been a growing trend of Xenophobia within British towards the Welsh for a number of years. Off the back of our Euro success perhaps? D James while at man utd, Neco at L'pool, Joe Allen at L'pool, Ben Davies at Tottenham have all been singled out or made scapegoats a number of times. Bale has also been the subject of jokes and abuse at the hands of English fans for years. Hmm…I don’t see it as being a Welsh issue. I suppose it could be interpreted that they are mocking the level he’s come from and that he’s a British manager with a boring name. “How on Earth could the manager of Luton ****ing town (with a name like Nathan Jones) be good enough for Southampton?!” etc. From supporters of a club that were losing to Bristol Rovers in league one in 2008 so they have very fresh memories of being a poxy lower league club themselves. Maybe that’s what winds me up the most about it actually- the superior nature of their attitude towards the unfashionable clubs that make up the rest of the pyramid. Give them a foreigner with an unpronounceable name and they probably wouldn’t care what his credentials were (as they have done with Selles it seems!) but Nathan Jones of Luton Town and it’s far too low brow for their top table sensibilities. |
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Post by iantov on Mar 2, 2023 19:00:02 GMT
Very well written piece, an enjoyable read. |
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Post by morg on May 24, 2023 11:48:00 GMT
Any basis for the Jones to Swansea speculation or just lazy journalism?
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Post by spiritof16 on Jun 16, 2023 20:17:43 GMT
Page out, Jones in.
Please.
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Post by bale-droed on Jun 19, 2023 9:06:49 GMT
Was just listening to the tifo podcast and they pointed out it was Nathan Jones Southampton side that stopped a Manchester City quadruple.
A crumb of comfort for Southampton fans and something small for Nathan Jones to add to his resume.
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Post by iantov on Feb 5, 2024 3:44:41 GMT
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Post by jimexotic on Feb 5, 2024 23:10:22 GMT
About his level.
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Post by CrackityJones on Mar 9, 2024 19:02:46 GMT
Good start to his Charlton career. Got them well clear of the drop now
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Post by welwyn on Mar 9, 2024 19:50:26 GMT
Everything he does fits my narrative that he is an extremely good coach who is completely un-media savvy and very abrasive as a character. The former killing him at Southampton and the later probably did for him at Stoke (although some equally good coaches seem to be doing just as bad/worse there anyway).
The one thing he is very bad at is making career moves. I think turning down Rotherham and taking the Charlton job might be inspired though.
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Post by surge on Mar 9, 2024 20:09:34 GMT
Everything he does fits my narrative that he is an extremely good coach who is completely un-media savvy and very abrasive as a character. The former killing him at Southampton and the later probably did for him at Stoke (although some equally good coaches seem to be doing just as bad/worse there anyway). The one thing he is very bad at is making career moves. I think turning down Rotherham and taking the Charlton job might be inspired though. I'd say this was fair. Going to Southampton half way through a season, whose fans weren't ready for more direct style and were already angry about state of their club, was probably a mistake. Luton are set up extremely well so Jones probably needs this job to go well in order to get away from accusation of only being able to work at Luton. |
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