Giggs

[alarch]

With Garry Monk losing his job at Middlesbrough it's not clear what's happened to first team coach Dave Adams. If he was also got rid of then he would be a first-rate successor to Osian Roberts. There are no excuses for not appointing Osian Roberts - unless someone outstanding appears out of the woodwork, which I can't see happening.

[yanto]

Dec 28, 2017 23:24:59 GMT alarch said:

With Garry Monk losing his job at Middlesbrough it's not clear what's happened to first team coach Dave Adams. If he was also got rid of then he would be a first-rate successor to Osian Roberts. There are no excuses for not appointing Osian Roberts - unless someone outstanding appears out of the woodwork, which I can't see happening.

This has probably been covered already so forgive me but IMHO Osian appears no different in terms of experience to Giggs, Osian has not managed at any real level (or at all?). He qualifies because he is assistant to Cookie etc? This has obvious parallels to Giggs with Louie VG? I understand the continuity thing but the danger is in complacency, pretty much the same as any work place when someone steps up to a manager role often does not have same impact as someone from outside. Additionally, elite sport is about confidence, can anyone honestly say that having Giggs behind you would not be inspiring? Does the same apply to Osian......not so sure.

[yanto]

Dec 28, 2017 20:51:02 GMT conwy10 said:

Dec 28, 2017 7:47:45 GMT yanto said:

A huge reality check is required on this forum i think. The job is not the most desirable in world football, we failed to get to the world cup and even the feckin play offs! We are not world beaters, we have had a great time in the sun but there is the real possibility we have returned to a more natural level. Its too easy to criticise Giggs in terms of inexperience, the other issues may apply one way or another to most of the others (bearing in mind Giggs has had more time under the spotlight) if they were subject to the same media scrutiny. Giggs with Osian would be most acceptable IMHO with as much chance of success as any one else.

I understand where you're coming from but we aren't asking for Guardiola, the majority want Osian Roberts who's already put himself forward for the job. If Osian wants it its a crime not to give it him unless it's for a top quality proven manager. Even if they think he's too good at what he does already to give it him they might as well slap him in the face and then say good job.

Giving it to a rookie when the main man in Welsh football for the last 4 years wants it would be shameful.

The main man ....who is the coach not manager. There is as much risk in promoting him as Giggs imo. May not be a popular view but we have no evidence that Osian would be a good manager.

[conwy10]

Dec 29, 2017 7:39:38 GMT yanto said:

Dec 28, 2017 23:24:59 GMT alarch said:

With Garry Monk losing his job at Middlesbrough it's not clear what's happened to first team coach Dave Adams. If he was also got rid of then he would be a first-rate successor to Osian Roberts. There are no excuses for not appointing Osian Roberts - unless someone outstanding appears out of the woodwork, which I can't see happening.

This has probably been covered already so forgive me but IMHO Osian appears no different in terms of experience to Giggs, Osian has not managed at any real level (or at all?). He qualifies because he is assistant to Cookie etc? This has obvious parallels to Giggs with Louie VG? I understand the continuity thing but the danger is in complacency, pretty much the same as any work place when someone steps up to a manager role often does not have same impact as someone from outside. Additionally, elite sport is about confidence, can anyone honestly say that having Giggs behind you would not be inspiring? Does the same apply to Osian......not so sure.

So people wouldn't be inspired by the person who's carried Welsh football for years? The coach who's been alongside them as they've advanced, the coach who probably bought them into the system. Osian has been running the Welsh youth teams, he's been a vital part of our success, he's put everything into place on the coaching side that's recruiting the football elite to come share their ideas in the Welsh set up. Giggs has been agreeing with Ian Wright that Harry Kane is a top class player.

Osian at Wales has been a lot more than an assistant, involved with putting everything into place. I guarantee at Man United it was more like hanging out with the cousin you don't like, you can be manager but Giggs has to be your assistant. Do you think he was coming up with ground breaking ideas for Man United or picking up cones?

[conwy10]

Dec 29, 2017 7:43:06 GMT yanto said:

Dec 28, 2017 20:51:02 GMT conwy10 said:

I understand where you're coming from but we aren't asking for Guardiola, the majority want Osian Roberts who's already put himself forward for the job. If Osian wants it its a crime not to give it him unless it's for a top quality proven manager. Even if they think he's too good at what he does already to give it him they might as well slap him in the face and then say good job.

Giving it to a rookie when the main man in Welsh football for the last 4 years wants it would be shameful.

The main man ....who is the coach not manager. There is as much risk in promoting him as Giggs imo. May not be a popular view but we have no evidence that Osian would be a good manager.

From what I've heard Osian was the brain and Coleman was the face. I was fortunate enough to hear both of them speak on separate occasions. Coleman spoke for 2 hours how good the lads were as people, Osian spoke for 2 hours about structure, tactics, ideas.

[yanto]

Dec 29, 2017 10:23:55 GMT conwy10 said:

Dec 29, 2017 7:39:38 GMT yanto said:

This has probably been covered already so forgive me but IMHO Osian appears no different in terms of experience to Giggs, Osian has not managed at any real level (or at all?). He qualifies because he is assistant to Cookie etc? This has obvious parallels to Giggs with Louie VG? I understand the continuity thing but the danger is in complacency, pretty much the same as any work place when someone steps up to a manager role often does not have same impact as someone from outside. Additionally, elite sport is about confidence, can anyone honestly say that having Giggs behind you would not be inspiring? Does the same apply to Osian......not so sure.

So people wouldn't be inspired by the person who's carried Welsh football for years? The coach who's been alongside them as they've advanced, the coach who probably bought them into the system. Osian has been running the Welsh youth teams, he's been a vital part of our success, he's put everything into place on the coaching side that's recruiting the football elite to come share their ideas in the Welsh set up. Giggs has been agreeing with Ian Wright that Harry Kane is a top class player.

Osian at Wales has been a lot more than an assistant, involved with putting everything into place. I guarantee at Man United it was more like hanging out with the cousin you don't like, you can be manager but Giggs has to be your assistant. Do you think he was coming up with ground breaking ideas for Man United or picking up cones?

I was referring to inspiring players not fans and on that basis who would inspire Bale, Rambo et al more? If Osian is the wonder man how come he has not been taken into club fottball? Or is that answer that he is only interested in welsh football? The point I am making overall is that Osian has the popular vote because, because. But suggesting he is a better option on the basis of experience as coach pushes it for me.

[yanto]

Dec 29, 2017 10:26:27 GMT conwy10 said:

Dec 29, 2017 7:43:06 GMT yanto said:

The main man ....who is the coach not manager. There is as much risk in promoting him as Giggs imo. May not be a popular view but we have no evidence that Osian would be a good manager.

From what I've heard Osian was the brain and Coleman was the face. I was fortunate enough to hear both of them speak on separate occasions. Coleman spoke for 2 hours how good the lads were as people, Osian spoke for 2 hours about structure, tactics, ideas.

It kind of follows that reevaluation of Cookie's time is necessary then? He doesn't deserve much credit as all he did was public talks and looked good? Really?

[cymroircarn]

The way I see it is a manager picks his coaches for support but the manager makes the calls as it’s his head on the block.

I don’t see this different in any managerial role.

Our recent success was down to the sum of all parts rather than an individual be it Roberts or Coleman (ok maybe Bale)

I have seen both speak and agree with the above which is why Roberts is a coach and Coleman is a manager.

[conwy10]

Dec 29, 2017 13:30:11 GMT yanto said:

Dec 29, 2017 10:23:55 GMT conwy10 said:

So people wouldn't be inspired by the person who's carried Welsh football for years? The coach who's been alongside them as they've advanced, the coach who probably bought them into the system. Osian has been running the Welsh youth teams, he's been a vital part of our success, he's put everything into place on the coaching side that's recruiting the football elite to come share their ideas in the Welsh set up. Giggs has been agreeing with Ian Wright that Harry Kane is a top class player.

Osian at Wales has been a lot more than an assistant, involved with putting everything into place. I guarantee at Man United it was more like hanging out with the cousin you don't like, you can be manager but Giggs has to be your assistant. Do you think he was coming up with ground breaking ideas for Man United or picking up cones?

I was referring to inspiring players not fans and on that basis who would inspire Bale, Rambo et al more? If Osian is the wonder man how come he has not been taken into club fottball? Or is that answer that he is only interested in welsh football? The point I am making overall is that Osian has the popular vote because, because. But suggesting he is a better option on the basis of experience as coach pushes it for me.

I wasn't referring to the fans just the players. Osian was the one who encouraged the youngsters to try England confident of what we had, the players in the team and will be coming into the team are all because of Osian. Would the prefer to listen to Giggs give his 'I'm Ryan Giggs' style or the style of someone who knows what they're talking about because they've been there and done it.

Coleman did do a lot, I didn't say he didn't. He was the man manager and Osian the brains. And before it's bought up "why not bring Giggs in to be the man manager and keep Roberts as assistant" because Osian deserves the role. He's done more for Welsh football than anyone in history. More than Giggs, more than Bale, more than Rush, Charles, Coleman. He wants it it's a crime not to give it him.

[conwy10]

Dec 29, 2017 13:47:52 GMT cymroircarn said:

The way I see it is a manager picks his coaches for support but the manager makes the calls as it’s his head on the block.

I don’t see this different in any managerial role.

Our recent success was down to the sum of all parts rather than an individual be it Roberts or Coleman (ok maybe Bale)

I have seen both speak and agree with the above which is why Roberts is a coach and Coleman is a manager.

Roberts is a coach, Coleman is a manager and Giggs is a football pundit. And calling Roberts a coach is playing it down, he's the technical director. He doesn't just show players how to play, he shows the people who show the players how to coach the players. We have the opportunity to appoint a football genius as our head manager.

[pendragon]

Yes, Roberts is a coach and Coleman was the Manager. No reason why Roberts cannot make that transition to Manager though, particularly if it is true that he was thought to have been the "brains" behind the team strategies at Euro 2016. While he may not have experience of managing per se, I would argue that his role as Coleman's No. 2 gave him a unique insight into managing and the dynamics of the team. There is also no reason to doubt his passion or commitment. However, what worries me about Osian to some degree is precisely that sense of continuity we have been discussing. I believe Welsh football requires another shake-up if we are to qualify for future tournaments. I felt Coleman was a little too faithful to the "old guard" at times rather than shaking up the team and experimenting with younger and more inexperienced players at times. I am a little concerned that Osian might continue that trend.

[yanto]

Dec 29, 2017 20:44:17 GMT conwy10 said:

Dec 29, 2017 13:30:11 GMT yanto said:

I was referring to inspiring players not fans and on that basis who would inspire Bale, Rambo et al more? If Osian is the wonder man how come he has not been taken into club fottball? Or is that answer that he is only interested in welsh football? The point I am making overall is that Osian has the popular vote because, because. But suggesting he is a better option on the basis of experience as coach pushes it for me.

I wasn't referring to the fans just the players. Osian was the one who encouraged the youngsters to try England confident of what we had, the players in the team and will be coming into the team are all because of Osian. Would the prefer to listen to Giggs give his 'I'm Ryan Giggs' style or the style of someone who knows what they're talking about because they've been there and done it.

Coleman did do a lot, I didn't say he didn't. He was the man manager and Osian the brains. And before it's bought up "why not bring Giggs in to be the man manager and keep Roberts as assistant" because Osian deserves the role. He's done more for Welsh football than anyone in history. More than Giggs, more than Bale, more than Rush, Charles, Coleman. He wants it it's a crime not to give it him.

Sorry m8 the idea that the players would be more inspired by Osian who they have heard endlessly for several years over Giggs doesn't cut the (Coleman) mustard. At risk of repeating, elite sport is about confidence and the extra edge often about extra motivation or inspiration. Whether you like it or not Giggs provides that......something I am confident the players think too.

[conwy10]

Dec 30, 2017 9:59:15 GMT yanto said:

Dec 29, 2017 20:44:17 GMT conwy10 said:

I wasn't referring to the fans just the players. Osian was the one who encouraged the youngsters to try England confident of what we had, the players in the team and will be coming into the team are all because of Osian. Would the prefer to listen to Giggs give his 'I'm Ryan Giggs' style or the style of someone who knows what they're talking about because they've been there and done it.

Coleman did do a lot, I didn't say he didn't. He was the man manager and Osian the brains. And before it's bought up "why not bring Giggs in to be the man manager and keep Roberts as assistant" because Osian deserves the role. He's done more for Welsh football than anyone in history. More than Giggs, more than Bale, more than Rush, Charles, Coleman. He wants it it's a crime not to give it him.

Sorry m8 the idea that the players would be more inspired by Osian who they have heard endlessly for several years over Giggs doesn't cut the (Coleman) mustard. At risk of repeating, elite sport is about confidence and the extra edge often about extra motivation or inspiration. Whether you like it or not Giggs provides that......something I am confident the players think too.

When exactly have you heard Giggs say something inspiring? I don't see him as an inspirational person. Sure he's done a lot in his football career but I've never seen a video, a quote or anything that fired me up as a fan and I used to get fired up for Wales matches by Toshacks interviews. In the 2 years he was at Man United as assistant I didn't see anything to suggest he could fire up a team, they were awful. Has any current player actually say they want Giggs as manager? He was captain when a few senior players were coming through.

Peoples opinions will differ, I idolise Osian Roberts and as an up and coming coach I'm inspired by what he's done and could listen to him speak for hours. If the lads can't be inspired by him they don't know what they're missing.

[iot]

There's a lot of nonsense being spouted here about the supposed wow factor Giggs would bring. Gabbidon made the point really well on the elis james podcast, having that reputation would only take him so far. It might make a difference initially, but as soon as those few training and tactical sessions take place - that's what the players will judge him on. Toshack had a fantastic managerial and playing reputation and that did buy him time initially, but as soon as the players perceived his management as being inept, that went out of the window. The focus for us shouldn't be 'who will bring the bigest initial wow factor', it should be 'who will be the best candidate in leading us into games over the next two years'.

[pendragon]

Has anyone seen the two articles published today on Antonio Conte and Chelsea Ladies Boss Emma Hayes? Not exactly a ringing endorsement of Ryan Giggs. Hayes, in particular questions his lack of commitment to low-league management roles.

[saints19]

Dec 28, 2017 20:55:13 GMT conwy10 said:

Dec 28, 2017 19:04:44 GMT saints19 said:

Not at all, he's in discussions with the IFA about a new contract, if we entered the arena as a third possible destination you can't tell me we'd be poor relations. So frustrating the FAW aren't even trying.

He's Northern Irish and lives in Scotland, he has connection to both countries but none to Wales, I doubt we'd stand a chance even if we wanted him.

Maybe not, but the SFA have declared their interest. We should have done likewise. Maybe he says no, or maybe his demands are too high. But maybe he expresses interest in our squad. He would surely be looking at it in terms of not just salary but bonus potential. Do we offer better chance of actually qualifying (and the associated rewards) than Scotland or NI? Arguably. We're assuming the claims of the SFA offering £1m salary are true, when in all honesty they're probably media fuelled speculation.

It does look like O'Neill is going for the biggest contract possible. He has a lot of surrogates making comments in the press along those lines. As I said, maybe there's no chance he'd have been interested, but it's frustrating we haven't even made a public decleration of interest like Scotland.

[saints19]

Dec 30, 2017 11:38:44 GMT iot said:

There's a lot of nonsense being spouted here about the supposed wow factor Giggs would bring. Gabbidon made the point really well on the elis james podcast, having that reputation would only take him so far. It might make a difference initially, but as soon as those few training and tactical sessions take place - that's what the players will judge him on. Toshack had a fantastic managerial and playing reputation and that did buy him time initially, but as soon as the players perceived his management as being inept, that went out of the window. The focus for us shouldn't be 'who will bring the bigest initial wow factor', it should be 'who will be the best candidate in leading us into games over the next two years'.

Absolutely. Listening to Giggs speak as a pundit there is absolutely nothing inspiring about him. His playing CV is majestic but that clearly doesn't translate into management all the time. Honestly, Giggs has all the hallmarks of a Staunton appointment to me. On the other hand Iceland's manager wasn't even a full-timer (he had a day job as a dentist) when he took over from Lagerback, but he clearly has tactical acumen. Promoting a #2 certainly doesn't always work and I'd prefer a proven manager, but my opinion of Roberts' professional qualities is that he could make the step up.

[saints19]

Dec 30, 2017 9:59:15 GMT yanto said:

Dec 29, 2017 20:44:17 GMT conwy10 said:

I wasn't referring to the fans just the players. Osian was the one who encouraged the youngsters to try England confident of what we had, the players in the team and will be coming into the team are all because of Osian. Would the prefer to listen to Giggs give his 'I'm Ryan Giggs' style or the style of someone who knows what they're talking about because they've been there and done it.

Coleman did do a lot, I didn't say he didn't. He was the man manager and Osian the brains. And before it's bought up "why not bring Giggs in to be the man manager and keep Roberts as assistant" because Osian deserves the role. He's done more for Welsh football than anyone in history. More than Giggs, more than Bale, more than Rush, Charles, Coleman. He wants it it's a crime not to give it him.

Sorry m8 the idea that the players would be more inspired by Osian who they have heard endlessly for several years over Giggs doesn't cut the (Coleman) mustard. At risk of repeating, elite sport is about confidence and the extra edge often about extra motivation or inspiration. Whether you like it or not Giggs provides that......something I am confident the players think too.

You're making an unsupported statement about Giggs's supposed motivational qualities whereas we can clearly, evidently see Roberts was a valued member of our most successful management team in history. Why would Coleman have kept him around so long otherwise. In a choice between the two it's a no-brainer, Roberts wins easily. I still hope we can attract a more experienced international manager, but if not, Roberts is my choice.

[yanto]

Dec 30, 2017 23:50:33 GMT saints19 said:

Dec 30, 2017 9:59:15 GMT yanto said:

Sorry m8 the idea that the players would be more inspired by Osian who they have heard endlessly for several years over Giggs doesn't cut the (Coleman) mustard. At risk of repeating, elite sport is about confidence and the extra edge often about extra motivation or inspiration. Whether you like it or not Giggs provides that......something I am confident the players think too.

You're making an unsupported statement about Giggs's supposed motivational qualities whereas we can clearly, evidently see Roberts was a valued member of our most successful management team in history. Why would Coleman have kept him around so long otherwise. In a choice between the two it's a no-brainer, Roberts wins easily. I still hope we can attract a more experienced international manager, but if not, Roberts is my choice.

Pardon me for having an opinion that does not fit with the masses Lol. Whether you likenit or not many of the playersbwill be inspired by Giggs full stop. I am also a Osian fan but see nothing to suggest he can be a manager any more than Giggs. What i do think would work is a combo of both and hasn't Osian said positive things about Giggs? For the record i wanted Cookie when Speed got the job thinking he would be better......

[gwernybwch]

Dec 31, 2017 12:39:24 GMT yanto said:

Dec 30, 2017 23:50:33 GMT saints19 said:

You're making an unsupported statement about Giggs's supposed motivational qualities whereas we can clearly, evidently see Roberts was a valued member of our most successful management team in history. Why would Coleman have kept him around so long otherwise. In a choice between the two it's a no-brainer, Roberts wins easily. I still hope we can attract a more experienced international manager, but if not, Roberts is my choice.

Pardon me for having an opinion that does not fit with the masses Lol. Whether you likenit or not many of the playersbwill be inspired by Giggs full stop. I am also a Osian fan but see nothing to suggest he can be a manager any more than Giggs. What i do think would work is a combo of both and hasn't Osian said positive things about Giggs? For the record i wanted Cookie when Speed got the job thinking he would be better......

It looks like Giggs did inspire Bale and Ramsey. It inspired them to contact someone else and beg him to apply for the post!

[fiveattheback]

Dec 31, 2017 12:39:24 GMT yanto said:

Dec 30, 2017 23:50:33 GMT saints19 said:

You're making an unsupported statement about Giggs's supposed motivational qualities whereas we can clearly, evidently see Roberts was a valued member of our most successful management team in history. Why would Coleman have kept him around so long otherwise. In a choice between the two it's a no-brainer, Roberts wins easily. I still hope we can attract a more experienced international manager, but if not, Roberts is my choice.

Pardon me for having an opinion that does not fit with the masses Lol. Whether you likenit or not many of the playersbwill be inspired by Giggs full stop. I am also a Osian fan but see nothing to suggest he can be a manager any more than Giggs. What i do think would work is a combo of both and hasn't Osian said positive things about Giggs? For the record i wanted Cookie when Speed got the job thinking he would be better......

Why would they be inspired by Giggs?  What have you seen in Giggs regarding his motivational abilities that nobody else has?

[iot]

Dec 31, 2017 12:39:24 GMT yanto said:

Dec 30, 2017 23:50:33 GMT saints19 said:

You're making an unsupported statement about Giggs's supposed motivational qualities whereas we can clearly, evidently see Roberts was a valued member of our most successful management team in history. Why would Coleman have kept him around so long otherwise. In a choice between the two it's a no-brainer, Roberts wins easily. I still hope we can attract a more experienced international manager, but if not, Roberts is my choice.

Pardon me for having an opinion that does not fit with the masses Lol. Whether you likenit or not many of the playersbwill be inspired by Giggs full stop. I am also a Osian fan but see nothing to suggest he can be a manager any more than Giggs. What i do think would work is a combo of both and hasn't Osian said positive things about Giggs? For the record i wanted Cookie when Speed got the job thinking he would be better......

Adding 'full stop' at the end of a sentence doesn't make your argument any stronger.

I dislike Giggs because I think he could have done a lot more for us in his playing days if he had the same dedication as Bale and Rambo. However, if I thought Giggs would be a successful manager for us, I would be more than happy to put all of that aside. 

Many seem to have misunderstood the opposition to appointing Giggs. The general thrust of the argument in this thread is that there's an irrational opposition towards Giggs because of the way he let us down as a player. However, I think most are in the same boat as me - I dislike the way he constantly let us down and put his club first, but that has nothing to do with the reason I don't want him as manager. It's much simpler than that, I simply don't think he would make a good manager because of his lack of experience, demeanour (could you get a less charismatic person?) and any obvious qualities that would make a good manager. Osian Roberts, on the other hand, ticks all those boxes.

[saints19]

Dec 31, 2017 12:39:24 GMT yanto said:

Dec 30, 2017 23:50:33 GMT saints19 said:

You're making an unsupported statement about Giggs's supposed motivational qualities whereas we can clearly, evidently see Roberts was a valued member of our most successful management team in history. Why would Coleman have kept him around so long otherwise. In a choice between the two it's a no-brainer, Roberts wins easily. I still hope we can attract a more experienced international manager, but if not, Roberts is my choice.

Pardon me for having an opinion that does not fit with the masses Lol. Whether you likenit or not many of the playersbwill be inspired by Giggs full stop. I am also a Osian fan but see nothing to suggest he can be a manager any more than Giggs. What i do think would work is a combo of both and hasn't Osian said positive things about Giggs? For the record i wanted Cookie when Speed got the job thinking he would be better......

You're entitled to your opinion, no-one's disputing that, we're just saying you need to provide something to back it up with in order to convince other people of it.

Saying 'whether we like it or not' doesn't count.

[saints19]

Dec 31, 2017 14:20:54 GMT iot said:

Dec 31, 2017 12:39:24 GMT yanto said:

Pardon me for having an opinion that does not fit with the masses Lol. Whether you likenit or not many of the playersbwill be inspired by Giggs full stop. I am also a Osian fan but see nothing to suggest he can be a manager any more than Giggs. What i do think would work is a combo of both and hasn't Osian said positive things about Giggs? For the record i wanted Cookie when Speed got the job thinking he would be better......

Adding 'full stop' at the end of a sentence doesn't make your argument any stronger.

I dislike Giggs because I think he could have done a lot more for us in his playing days if he had the same dedication as Bale and Rambo. However, if I thought Giggs would be a successful manager for us, I would be more than happy to put all of that aside. 

Many seem to have misunderstood the opposition to appointing Giggs. The general thrust of the argument in this thread is that there's an irrational opposition towards Giggs because of the way he let us down as a player. However, I think most are in the same boat as me - I dislike the way he constantly let us down and put his club first, but that has nothing to do with the reason I don't want him as manager. It's much simpler than that, I simply don't think he would make a good manager because of his lack of experience, demeanour (could you get a less charismatic person?) and any obvious qualities that would make a good manager. Osian Roberts, on the other hand, ticks all those boxes.

I'm not sure Roberts is particularly charismatic, but I do feel the players would respect him. If a charismatic ex-player wanted to be part of his team as No.2, I'd be for that as likability is an important trait in an international management team. I'm with you though, Giggs is not charismatic at all and will do nothing to boost the team's morale. He would probably over-rule Osian instead which would just lead to confusion and chaos.

[manulike]

I am still on the fence re: Giggs.
But here is an interesting fight-back article from the man

www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/wales-target-ryan-giggs-defends-14097551

[conwy10]

Dec 31, 2017 14:20:54 GMT iot said:

Dec 31, 2017 12:39:24 GMT yanto said:

Pardon me for having an opinion that does not fit with the masses Lol. Whether you likenit or not many of the playersbwill be inspired by Giggs full stop. I am also a Osian fan but see nothing to suggest he can be a manager any more than Giggs. What i do think would work is a combo of both and hasn't Osian said positive things about Giggs? For the record i wanted Cookie when Speed got the job thinking he would be better......

Adding 'full stop' at the end of a sentence doesn't make your argument any stronger.

I dislike Giggs because I think he could have done a lot more for us in his playing days if he had the same dedication as Bale and Rambo. However, if I thought Giggs would be a successful manager for us, I would be more than happy to put all of that aside. 

Many seem to have misunderstood the opposition to appointing Giggs. The general thrust of the argument in this thread is that there's an irrational opposition towards Giggs because of the way he let us down as a player. However, I think most are in the same boat as me - I dislike the way he constantly let us down and put his club first, but that has nothing to do with the reason I don't want him as manager. It's much simpler than that, I simply don't think he would make a good manager because of his lack of experience, demeanour (could you get a less charismatic person?) and any obvious qualities that would make a good manager. Osian Roberts, on the other hand, ticks all those boxes.

Exactly this. When discussing managers it seems people will accept the reasons behind everyone except Giggs. He's got no experience, can't get a managers position at a top club, doesn't want to lower himself to do what many others have done before him and start at the bottom and work his way up. Why doesn't he do a Saunders or a Rush and go to a Wrexham or a Chester?

[conwy10]

Dec 31, 2017 17:38:57 GMT manulike said:

I am still on the fence re: Giggs.
But here is an interesting fight-back article from the man

www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/wales-target-ryan-giggs-defends-14097551

Got the ethos of building something... waits until a top level job comes up. Go to a club like Forest Green or Morcambe and use your ethos to build something if that's really your mentality.

In terms of his coaching I do more of it then he did when he put in the "hard work". Try coaching in 3 schools and then driving 2 hours to do a 2 hour session and then 2 hours home, doing football 7 days a week like grassroots coaches are doing now.

The more he talks the less respect I have for him. He oozes entitlement. Congratulations on your work with Vietnam by the way, you can be their manager. Try doing something for Wales.

[pendragon]

None of the three candidates - Osian, Bellamy and Giggs - have proven managerial qualities. Even if we throw Carl Robinson into the mix (who has a proven managerial record), none of those names jump out as an outstanding candidate. Each one in their own unique way would involve an element of risk and a step into the unknown. In some way, the pool of candidates are evenly matched and we don't know how Giggs or Bellamy would perform as managers. The only one who edges out somewhat for me is Osian and he would be my first choice due to the insight he has having worked so closely with Coleman and Speed. Hence, my personal preference would be for him to get it with possibly Giggs as his No. 2 (no idea if he'd take the role although he did assume it for some time with Van Gaal).

[saints19]

Dec 31, 2017 17:38:57 GMT manulike said:

I am still on the fence re: Giggs.
But here is an interesting fight-back article from the man

www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/wales-target-ryan-giggs-defends-14097551

Direct quotes from the man:


But he hit back, writing in a diary for Sky Sports : "I did an interview last week about my managerial aspirations and received some criticism because apparently I wasn't willing to manage at a lower level.

"I didn't say anything at all about not managing at a lower level; I said because of my experience, I'd be more suited coaching at the level which I previously played and coached.

"My critic quoted Steven Gerrard saying, in his experience, footballers want to just do their UEFA C Licence and go straight into the job. I did my UEFA B Licence when I was 29, my A Licence when I was 35, my Pro Licence while I was still playing and I coached at Manchester United for three years - including managing four games - so I don't see the relevance.

"The argument that players who have been a success can't go into success is a non-argument. People use Jose Mourinho and Arsene Wenger but there are also countless examples of unsuccessful players being unsuccessful managers. It is all down to the individual.

"I played until I was 40 so I was doing my Pro Licence on a Saturday and Sunday, training on a Monday and Tuesday, doing more coaching and then driving back for Champions League games on Wednesday. To say I haven't put in the work is ridiculous."

Nothing in that is really convincing for me, I'm afraid.

I agree with conwy10, if he thinks that's a heavy workload, he should probably try doing the hours that some people do, just to make ends meet. It does seem rather entitled, and he's doing absolutely nothing to dispel the views that exist about him.

I think the critics would only go away if he got a club job at say Championship level and did reasonably well - which is basically the whole point of the opposition to Giggs.

[cymroircarn]

Dec 31, 2017 22:30:28 GMT saints19 said:

Dec 31, 2017 17:38:57 GMT manulike said:

I am still on the fence re: Giggs.
But here is an interesting fight-back article from the man

www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/wales-target-ryan-giggs-defends-14097551

Direct quotes from the man:


But he hit back, writing in a diary for Sky Sports : "I did an interview last week about my managerial aspirations and received some criticism because apparently I wasn't willing to manage at a lower level.

"I didn't say anything at all about not managing at a lower level; I said because of my experience, I'd be more suited coaching at the level which I previously played and coached.

"My critic quoted Steven Gerrard saying, in his experience, footballers want to just do their UEFA C Licence and go straight into the job. I did my UEFA B Licence when I was 29, my A Licence when I was 35, my Pro Licence while I was still playing and I coached at Manchester United for three years - including managing four games - so I don't see the relevance.

"The argument that players who have been a success can't go into success is a non-argument. People use Jose Mourinho and Arsene Wenger but there are also countless examples of unsuccessful players being unsuccessful managers. It is all down to the individual.

"I played until I was 40 so I was doing my Pro Licence on a Saturday and Sunday, training on a Monday and Tuesday, doing more coaching and then driving back for Champions League games on Wednesday. To say I haven't put in the work is ridiculous."

Nothing in that is really convincing for me, I'm afraid.

I agree with conwy10, if he thinks that's a heavy workload, he should probably try doing the hours that some people do, just to make ends meet. It does seem rather entitled, and he's doing absolutely nothing to dispel the views that exist about him.

I think the critics would only go away if he got a club job at say Championship level and did reasonably well - which is basically the whole point of the opposition to Giggs.

I wish the journalist had asked him with all the free time on his hands what has he done the last 2 yers?

Football is constantly evolving so what is he doing to make sure he is keeping up with things?