|
Giggs
Oct 16, 2018 22:14:34 GMT
via mobile
Post by quetzal on Oct 16, 2018 22:14:34 GMT
I thought he might have given Danny Ward 45 mins tonight. Was not to be
*edit. Against Spain
|
|
|
Post by saints19 on Oct 16, 2018 22:16:17 GMT
I think he made the right call, would have been a huge gamble to swap keepers midway through a competitive game.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 16, 2018 22:19:16 GMT
via mobile
Post by conwy10 on Oct 16, 2018 22:19:16 GMT
It's a results business and he's got the main target which was to not get relegated from this group with a game to spare. Still not convinced in the way the team is playing and think we will struggle against better teams, but he's gone a big way towards qualifying for the Euros tonight by ensuring we're in the 2nd pot for the main draw. That is massive, it makes the difference between our main opposition for 2nd likely being someone like Denmark, or someone like Scotland. Long way to go but the two wins v ROI are vital ones. Was the main target not to get relegated? With an opportunity to qualify early for the Euros at stake I think the target should be to win the group and put ourselves in contention in the playoff.
|
|
|
Post by dai on Oct 16, 2018 22:21:17 GMT
Brave and bold to put trust in players like Smith and T Roberts. He must really like Smith as I don't think many managers would've picked him out.
Based on Smith's performance tonight I would have no qualms in starting him over Ampadu against Denmark. He was that good.
|
|
|
Post by quetzal on Oct 16, 2018 22:21:36 GMT
I think he made the right call, would have been a huge gamble to swap keepers midway through a competitive game. Too much coffee. I meant the other night
|
|
|
Post by saints19 on Oct 16, 2018 22:23:03 GMT
It's a results business and he's got the main target which was to not get relegated from this group with a game to spare. Still not convinced in the way the team is playing and think we will struggle against better teams, but he's gone a big way towards qualifying for the Euros tonight by ensuring we're in the 2nd pot for the main draw. That is massive, it makes the difference between our main opposition for 2nd likely being someone like Denmark, or someone like Scotland. Long way to go but the two wins v ROI are vital ones. Was the main target not to get relegated? With an opportunity to qualify early for the Euros at stake I think the target should be to win the group and put ourselves in contention in the playoff. There is no opportunity to qualify early for the Euros. If we win our group, we are guaranteed a play-off which takes place after the whole qualification process. If we are 2nd, I'd say all the group winners will qualify automatically anyway, so, should we need a play-off we'll surely get one. The most important thing was to be 2nd seeds for the main draw - I think that's our best chance of qualifying, or at least the one least down to one or two chance matches.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 16, 2018 22:25:52 GMT
Post by saints19 on Oct 16, 2018 22:25:52 GMT
Brave and bold to put trust in players like Smith and T Roberts. He must really like Smith as I don't think many managers would've picked him out. Based on Smith's performance tonight I would have no qualms in starting him over Ampadu against Denmark. He was that good. I would say Ampadu should start, but Smith did well after a shaky start and almost giving away a goal. He was key in dominating the midfield, and performed creditably alongside Allen. For me, the starting three is probably Ampadu-Allen-Ramsey, with Ledley and Smith the options.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 16, 2018 22:30:46 GMT
via mobile
Post by conwy10 on Oct 16, 2018 22:30:46 GMT
Was the main target not to get relegated? With an opportunity to qualify early for the Euros at stake I think the target should be to win the group and put ourselves in contention in the playoff. There is no opportunity to qualify early for the Euros. If we win our group, we are guaranteed a play-off which takes place after the whole qualification process. If we are 2nd, I'd say all the group winners will qualify automatically anyway, so, should we need a play-off we'll surely get one. The most important thing was to be 2nd seeds for the main draw - I think that's our best chance of qualifying, or at least the one least down to one or two chance matches. Ah right sorry my mistake. This is still slightly confusing me, at least another chance if we don’t qualify I guess. So if we and Denmark qualify outright in the qualifiers Ireland will take our place in the play offs despite finishing bottom?
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 16, 2018 22:42:46 GMT
Post by saints19 on Oct 16, 2018 22:42:46 GMT
There is no opportunity to qualify early for the Euros. If we win our group, we are guaranteed a play-off which takes place after the whole qualification process. If we are 2nd, I'd say all the group winners will qualify automatically anyway, so, should we need a play-off we'll surely get one. The most important thing was to be 2nd seeds for the main draw - I think that's our best chance of qualifying, or at least the one least down to one or two chance matches. Ah right sorry my mistake. This is still slightly confusing me, at least another chance if we don’t qualify I guess. So if we and Denmark qualify outright in the qualifiers Ireland will take our place in the play offs despite finishing bottom? If any teams winning their groups in League B have already qualified automatically, their place automatically goes to the next team not qualified, according to the overall Nations League ranking. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018–19_UEFA_Nations_LeagueScroll down to "Overall ranking" to see current rankings. Essentially the teams finishing first are guaranteed to be ahead of the teams finishing 2nd, and then 3rd and so on in their groups, but then it goes down to points, goal difference etc. So if us and Denmark have already made it automatically but Austria who finished 2nd didn't, the place for our group winners goes to Austria first, then any 3rd placed teams. Complicated, but simple enough when you get it.
|
|
|
Post by insertname on Oct 16, 2018 23:12:22 GMT
Well myself and Storm(insert name) gave him credit in the Denmark defeat because he set up to win. Same tonight Texan too. I wasn't paying attention in any great depth tonight (nations league feels a bit mickey mouse) But certainly against Denmark we looked very exciting for the first 20 minutes and took the game to an excellent side and looked better than them. I stand by my assertion that I would rather see us play the Giggs way and try and get on the front foot. Although there may be a case for a rigid Coleman style when playing upper tier 1 nations such as Spain or Germany.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 17, 2018 0:11:33 GMT
Post by saints19 on Oct 17, 2018 0:11:33 GMT
Well myself and Storm(insert name) gave him credit in the Denmark defeat because he set up to win. Same tonight Texan too. I wasn't paying attention in any great depth tonight (nations league feels a bit mickey mouse) But certainly against Denmark we looked very exciting for the first 20 minutes and took the game to an excellent side and looked better than them. I stand by my assertion that I would rather see us play the Giggs way and try and get on the front foot. Although there may be a case for a rigid Coleman style when playing upper tier 1 nations such as Spain or Germany. Or even teams like Denmark. Or Croatia. Actually, we had to dig in defensively to beat ROI tonight, which we did, thankfully. We almost committed suicide a couple of times early on, but we were more pragmatic in the 2nd half.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 17, 2018 0:22:31 GMT
Post by zenith on Oct 17, 2018 0:22:31 GMT
I was fairly sure he would've started King tonight, glad to proved wrong. Matty Smith was bloody excellent, so pleased for him.
It's very hard to pick a 23 with so many strong options when everyone is fit!
Mine would be:
Hennessey, Ward, Maxwell
Davies, Williams, Chester, C Roberts, Mepham, Gunter, Dummett, Rodon
Ramsey, Allen, Ampadu, Smith, Evans, Wilson, Brooks
Bale, T Roberts, Lawrence, Vokes, Woodburn
Other candidates to not make it - Richards, Ledley, Gwion, John, King, G Thomas etc. not to mention the likes of Huws, Williams, Bradshaw etc.
Future is very bright!
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 17, 2018 0:35:35 GMT
via mobile
Post by quetzal on Oct 17, 2018 0:35:35 GMT
I was fairly sure he would've started King tonight, glad to proved wrong. Matty Smith was bloody excellent, so pleased for him. It's very hard to pick a 23 with so many strong options when everyone is fit! Mine would be: Hennessey, Ward, Maxwell Davies, Williams, Chester, C Roberts, Mepham, Gunter, Dummett, Rodon Ramsey, Allen, Ampadu, Smith, Evans, Wilson, Brooks Bale, T Roberts, Lawrence, Vokes, Woodburn Other candidates to not make it - Richards, Ledley, Gwion, John, King, G Thomas etc. not to mention the likes of Huws, Williams, Bradshaw etc. Future is very bright! I don’t think we’ll ever see Huws or Bradshaw again. Williams could but made of glass. Giggs probably thinks there’s no continuity with Williams because of injuries
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 17, 2018 1:03:54 GMT
Post by ausred88 on Oct 17, 2018 1:03:54 GMT
He has incredible knowledge of football & winning. The only question was could he apply that to teaching other people? The early signs are good.
|
|
|
Post by haruki on Oct 17, 2018 9:22:50 GMT
His selections have been very brave. The stand out selection for bravery is for me how he brought Connor Roberts in over Gunter. Gunts was such an experienced and steady selection and is so popular with players and fans that if that selection had backfired it could have damaged Giggs early and turned the senior players against him but he was brave enough to trust his judgement that Connor was ready and was better placed to deliver the new gameplan. Similarly it would have been safer to pick Vokes and King over Tyler and Smith last night but Giggs showed his ruthlessness in delivering his own ideas
If we beat Denmark (which we are more than capable of) and get promoted to Pot A then that is a fantastic achievement from this young squad and will give us regular games against top nations to really test the metal of this young team.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 17, 2018 11:13:37 GMT
Post by 1gwaunview on Oct 17, 2018 11:13:37 GMT
Let's not get carried away. Qualify for a tournament first, then he can really demand respect as Wales manager in football terms. Anything less is a failure.
|
|
|
Post by saints19 on Oct 17, 2018 12:00:38 GMT
Indeed, essentially what has been achieved so far is to beat the Republic twice and reach pot 2. Massive step in the right direction, but we aren't at the goal yet.
|
|
|
Post by bringbackelmo on Oct 17, 2018 12:09:46 GMT
Let's not get carried away. Qualify for a tournament first, then he can really demand respect as Wales manager in football terms. Anything less is a failure. Completely agree, at HT last night it wasn't looking too clever. Looking at the results so far....a good hammering of China followed by narrow defeat to Uruguay. A creditable draw with Mexico. Two wins over a poor ROI (one of them an excellent performance) but a hammering by Spain and a fairly comprehensive defeat in Denmark. Definitely some good early promise but a long way to go yet.
|
|
|
Post by alarch on Oct 17, 2018 14:11:32 GMT
It's a bit of a mixed bag from Giggs. The positivity in his selections and attacking game plan has been great. Set against that is a bit of a gung ho attitude at times that hasn't fully respected the strength of the opposition - especially against Denmark - where we were wide open with our 4-4-2. The more conservative gameplan against ROI last night (first half anyway) may reflect that Giggs has learned from the experience of the Denmark game.
One trivial gripe is how we seem to have largely abandoned the Together Stronger mantra of the Coleman era. It's bad enough that we, as fans, are falling out over the PS/CCS debate, but I don't get the feeling that there's the same enthusiasm when it comes to singing the anthem. This may seem trivial, but this small act would reflect an emotional intelligence that seeks to bond fans to the team - which worked so well in the Euro campaign.
Also, when Giggs is being interviewed on S4C is it too much to ask for him to respond to a "Diolch" at the end of the interview with a "Diolch" in return? I'm not asking him to learn Welsh - just to show a bit of respect, which goes a long way to bridge the divide between Welsh and non-Welsh speakers. I wonder - does he get it, or not? My guess is he doesn't - which is a shame because it would help him in the long run when it comes building a rapport with the fan base and the fans in return then cutting him some slack when results are poor.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 17, 2018 14:17:59 GMT
Post by rossyjones on Oct 17, 2018 14:17:59 GMT
Seeing that team selection yesterday was a breath of fresh air. Fair play to him for that. As ever, the real test is against Denmark now
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 17, 2018 14:50:51 GMT
Post by dai on Oct 17, 2018 14:50:51 GMT
It's a bit of a mixed bag from Giggs. The positivity in his selections and attacking game plan has been great. Set against that is a bit of a gung ho attitude at times that hasn't fully respected the strength of the opposition - especially against Denmark - where we were wide open with our 4-4-2. The more conservative gameplan against ROI last night (first half anyway) may reflect that Giggs has learned from the experience of the Denmark game. One trivial gripe is how we seem to have largely abandoned the Together Stronger mantra of the Coleman era. It's bad enough that we, as fans, are falling out over the PS/CCS debate, but I don't get the feeling that there's the same enthusiasm when it comes to singing the anthem. This may seem trivial, but this small act would reflect an emotional intelligence that seeks to bond fans to the team - which worked so well in the Euro campaign. Also, when Giggs is being interviewed on S4C is it too much to ask for him to respond to a "Diolch" at the end of the interview with a "Diolch" in return? I'm not asking him to learn Welsh - just to show a bit of respect, which goes a long way to bridge the divide between Welsh and non-Welsh speakers. I wonder - does he get it, or not? My guess is he doesn't - which is a shame because it would help him in the long run when it comes building a rapport with the fan base and the fans in return then cutting him some slack when results are poor. To be fair, I haven't heard a player respond with 'Diolch' either - correct me if I'm wrong though. And yes, that would be nice to hear from player and manager. I remember the 'diolch / thank you' video that the FAW produced after the Euro's, which was a genius and emotional bit of marketing. Along with the Diolch tshirts after the Andorra match. The FAW have been praised immensely for leading the line in bilingual marketing over the past few years, far surpassing the WRU. Hope they don't forget to do that.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 17, 2018 15:11:39 GMT
Post by 1gwaunview on Oct 17, 2018 15:11:39 GMT
Wondering if Giggs knows the words to the National anthem. Hardly opens his mouth when cameras are on him. Dissimilar to Coleman, Speed, Hughes and Toshack. Would it be too much for him to mouth the words even if he doesn't sing? Perhaps Osian should give him a lesson.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 17, 2018 15:20:19 GMT
Post by bringbackelmo on Oct 17, 2018 15:20:19 GMT
Wondering if Giggs knows the words to the National anthem. Hardly opens his mouth when cameras are on him. Dissimilar to Coleman, Speed, Hughes and Toshack. Would it be too much for him to mouth the words even if he doesn't sing? Perhaps Osian should give him a lesson. It really isn't that hard to learn so it's disappointing he doesn't seem to have made the effort yet.
|
|
|
Post by holmesdaleultra on Oct 17, 2018 15:50:07 GMT
Doing well so far, but to be fair its his first proper job as a manager so he will make mistakes but just as long as he learns from them.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 18, 2018 12:14:48 GMT
Post by yanto on Oct 18, 2018 12:14:48 GMT
It's a bit of a mixed bag from Giggs. The positivity in his selections and attacking game plan has been great. Set against that is a bit of a gung ho attitude at times that hasn't fully respected the strength of the opposition - especially against Denmark - where we were wide open with our 4-4-2. The more conservative gameplan against ROI last night (first half anyway) may reflect that Giggs has learned from the experience of the Denmark game. One trivial gripe is how we seem to have largely abandoned the Together Stronger mantra of the Coleman era. It's bad enough that we, as fans, are falling out over the PS/CCS debate, but I don't get the feeling that there's the same enthusiasm when it comes to singing the anthem. This may seem trivial, but this small act would reflect an emotional intelligence that seeks to bond fans to the team - which worked so well in the Euro campaign. Also, when Giggs is being interviewed on S4C is it too much to ask for him to respond to a "Diolch" at the end of the interview with a "Diolch" in return? I'm not asking him to learn Welsh - just to show a bit of respect, which goes a long way to bridge the divide between Welsh and non-Welsh speakers. I wonder - does he get it, or not? My guess is he doesn't - which is a shame because it would help him in the long run when it comes building a rapport with the fan base and the fans in return then cutting him some slack when results are poor. As a non welsh speaking welshman he perhaps finds its a little tricky even having a go at a diolch, i know that i do. And if he did and fluffed it i suspect the level of flak will just go through the roof. Give the guy a break.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 18, 2018 12:26:31 GMT
Post by 1gwaunview on Oct 18, 2018 12:26:31 GMT
It's a bit of a mixed bag from Giggs. The positivity in his selections and attacking game plan has been great. Set against that is a bit of a gung ho attitude at times that hasn't fully respected the strength of the opposition - especially against Denmark - where we were wide open with our 4-4-2. The more conservative gameplan against ROI last night (first half anyway) may reflect that Giggs has learned from the experience of the Denmark game. One trivial gripe is how we seem to have largely abandoned the Together Stronger mantra of the Coleman era. It's bad enough that we, as fans, are falling out over the PS/CCS debate, but I don't get the feeling that there's the same enthusiasm when it comes to singing the anthem. This may seem trivial, but this small act would reflect an emotional intelligence that seeks to bond fans to the team - which worked so well in the Euro campaign. Also, when Giggs is being interviewed on S4C is it too much to ask for him to respond to a "Diolch" at the end of the interview with a "Diolch" in return? I'm not asking him to learn Welsh - just to show a bit of respect, which goes a long way to bridge the divide between Welsh and non-Welsh speakers. I wonder - does he get it, or not? My guess is he doesn't - which is a shame because it would help him in the long run when it comes building a rapport with the fan base and the fans in return then cutting him some slack when results are poor. As a non welsh speaking welshman he perhaps finds its a little tricky even having a go at a diolch, i know that i do. And if he did and fluffed it i suspect the level of flak will just go through the roof. Give the guy a break. No excuse, 'diolch' isn't difficult to say. I've friends from all over the world who've had no issues with saying it. His Dutch assistant was singing the anthem, so why not Giggs?
|
|
|
Post by alarch on Oct 18, 2018 12:41:06 GMT
What I liked about the use of Welsh in the Euro 2016 campaign is that it made me, as a Welsh-speaker, feel more included than I did previously - not that I felt excluded previously either. It may well have been a marketing gimmick - although given the involvement of Ian Gwyn-Hughes and Osian Roberts within the FAW I suspect there was more to it than that. But when a non-Welsh speaker uses the odd word of Welsh I couldn't give a monkeys if they do so fluently - I'm just gratified that they've made the effort. I suspect that most Welsh-speakers feel the same way - we're easily pleased. I also think that when a non-Welsh speaker uses the odd word of Welsh I see that as them as also including themselves - in the linguistically, ethnically and culturally diverse nation that is Wales/Cymru. The Welsh language is a needless divide into haves and have not - a bit of sensitivity and awareness on both sides of the language divide can go a long way to build bridges. That happened during Euro 2016 - I don't want us to row back on that.
|
|
|
Giggs
Oct 18, 2018 14:07:42 GMT
Post by 1gwaunview on Oct 18, 2018 14:07:42 GMT
#TogetherStronger finished with Chris Coleman's exit.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2018 14:13:18 GMT
You wouldn't hear any Welsh spoken in the part of Pembrokeshire I grew up in. I've also spent bits of time in Newport and Cardiff where it also wasn't spoken. At first, I was genuinely taken aback to meet people who were first language Welsh. i.e. Only spoke it at home with their families. Through the football I have learned little bits which is nice. I have CYMRU tattooed on my forearm too.
The emphasis on younger ones in education should be bilingual. I've no need professionally to be able to speak Welsh but it's something I would do if I found myself resident in a predominantly Welsh speaking part of the country. Anything else just isn't right. I know several white Brits who speak Urdu.
|
|
|
Post by yanto on Oct 18, 2018 19:19:50 GMT
As a non welsh speaking welshman he perhaps finds its a little tricky even having a go at a diolch, i know that i do. And if he did and fluffed it i suspect the level of flak will just go through the roof. Give the guy a break. No excuse, 'diolch' isn't difficult to say. I've friends from all over the world who've had no issues with saying it. His Dutch assistant was singing the anthem, so why not Giggs? Missing the point, i am making an observation that everyone is different and some may be more self concious of sounding like a twat. And tbh you have kinda proved my point that if he gets it wrong he will be slate.
|
|