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Post by texan on May 25, 2021 8:39:38 GMT
1. There was more to his expulsion from the last squad than we know about - perhaps he reacted badly to it. This is probably the most plausible explanation of all, which is a pity to be honest. Always thought HRK was one of the old (responsible) heads, so if he did react poorly it would be very disappointing to hear. I have one other thought though, I wonder if this non-selection is down to something agreed beforehand. When he announced his availability again both he and Giggs said that it was for the long term and that HRK didn't necessarily expect to be picked for the Euros as he hadn't taken part in the quals. Even if he wasn't picked, he said he was ready to step back in full-time for the next campaign. The March games were the WCQ's, so I wonder if they've agreed the Hal takes no part in the Euros but steps back in come September? I guess Page's first press conference will reveal the answer.
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Post by insertname on May 25, 2021 12:35:57 GMT
Conversely though the whole “Take OFW because he paints pictures and plays songs” does the same to me because it makes it sound like a stag do at Butlins. These guys are footballers and should be there because they are the best footballers the country can offer, not the best craic the country can offer. If I was a player I’d certainly feel a bit insulted if I knew I’d been picked just to tell some jokes round the campfire and that the management were secretly dreading that I might get on the pitch by a quirk of fate. Anyway, given the schedule and the travelling I doubt the squads are going to be in bubbles as much as they typically are so surely less need to go hunting for “characters” whose granny owned a caravan in Rhyl in the 70’s. And the greatest bugbear of them all? Binary thinking... It is either or though isn’t it- especially in OFW’s case. We’ve seen calls recently on here for him to be taken to the Euros again just because of his personality and not for any footballing ability. He plays at jokeshop level and it devalues call ups if you’re just looking to pad a squad out by picking players primarily on personality because you expect them not to play. Mind you I expect people on here are over thinking this whole picking characters thing anyway because if you pick the 26 best players surely to God you’ve got high odds that at least 2 of them will have enough character to bring a bit of atmosphere without needing to specifically pick lesser players to fill that role at the possible expense of better ones.
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Post by cogancoronation31 on May 25, 2021 13:14:10 GMT
Bit of respect for OFW please... he does not play "at jokeshop level". Has had a good season between the sticks at Dunfermline, where he is well thought of (perhaps more so in purely footballing terms than in his homeland).
Anyway, back to HRK... and here's wishing Hal a belated Happy Birthday for last week (21 May)!
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Post by iot on May 25, 2021 18:50:00 GMT
And the greatest bugbear of them all? Binary thinking... It is either or though isn’t it- especially in OFW’s case. We’ve seen calls recently on here for him to be taken to the Euros again just because of his personality and not for any footballing ability. He plays at jokeshop level and it devalues call ups if you’re just looking to pad a squad out by picking players primarily on personality because you expect them not to play. Mind you I expect people on here are over thinking this whole picking characters thing anyway because if you pick the 26 best players surely to God you’ve got high odds that at least 2 of them will have enough character to bring a bit of atmosphere without needing to specifically pick lesser players to fill that role at the possible expense of better ones. No, it really isn't an either or. There will be many factors at play when considering the final 26. First will be footballing ability. Also high on the list will be things like fitness, complementarity and suitability for the preferred systems. The players' character and what they bring in training / around camp, particularly when those players aren't likely to play, will also be a factor. To say it's purely to do with the 26 players playing at the highest level is a simplistic, silly way of looking at it. Do you think that footballing ability is the only enabler of success? If so, why do you think England almost always crash and burn whereas Wales have done remarkably well each time we've qualified? The best example is 2016, where our boys always talked about how much they enjoyed each other's company. That generated positivity and togetherness which affected our performances on the pitch. I think it's a massive part in how we did so much better than the sum of our parts. England, meanwhile, were extremely cagey everytime they were in front of a camera, didn't seem to enjoy the experience and it showed on the pitch!
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Post by insertname on May 25, 2021 21:04:22 GMT
It is either or though isn’t it- especially in OFW’s case. We’ve seen calls recently on here for him to be taken to the Euros again just because of his personality and not for any footballing ability. He plays at jokeshop level and it devalues call ups if you’re just looking to pad a squad out by picking players primarily on personality because you expect them not to play. Mind you I expect people on here are over thinking this whole picking characters thing anyway because if you pick the 26 best players surely to God you’ve got high odds that at least 2 of them will have enough character to bring a bit of atmosphere without needing to specifically pick lesser players to fill that role at the possible expense of better ones. No, it really isn't an either or. There will be many factors at play when considering the final 26. First will be footballing ability. Also high on the list will be things like fitness, complementarity and suitability for the preferred systems. The players' character and what they bring in training / around camp, particularly when those players aren't likely to play, will also be a factor. To say it's purely to do with the 26 players playing at the highest level is a simplistic, silly way of looking at it. Do you think that footballing ability is the only enabler of success? If so, why do you think England almost always crash and burn whereas Wales have done remarkably well each time we've qualified? The best example is 2016, where our boys always talked about how much they enjoyed each other's company. That generated positivity and togetherness which affected our performances on the pitch. I think it's a massive part in how we did so much better than the sum of our parts. England, meanwhile, were extremely cagey everytime they were in front of a camera, didn't seem to enjoy the experience and it showed on the pitch! But that’s a daft comparison because you are talking about one team who was able to laugh their way all the way to the semi final because they were never favourites for anything at any point and another who is expected to make the semi final (when they haven’t made a semi-final for 20 years hence) and whose press is out to character assassinate every player and is always trying to peddle a narrative that the players are over paid and don’t care. I’ll bet the Wales players wouldn’t have found it such a laugh if they had the entire country expecting them to win and a press sharpening knives. The England players probably looked on at Wales enviously wishing they could have nothing expected of them too. That’s why the England players struggle to give their best and end up losing to (relative) shite like Iceland. Wales had a free play, never the favourites to win a single game apart from slight favourites to beat Northern Ireland but not enough to cause any serious pressure. When were Wales last under serious pressure before that? 1-0 down against Andorra- and we didn’t look particularly good or particularly together that night. What got Wales out of that one was simply one man’s supreme talent and determination not together stronger or the third choice keeper playing songs. England potentially have that situation almost *every game* so it’s no wonder that they don’t really enjoy playing for their country or the experience of being in a finals camp. Saying that I’m sure the expectation on the Germans is similar, but they have a ruthless winner’s mindset and cope with it with ease. They have looked pretty joyless at times over the years and I’d be very surprised if they picked water carrier’s who were prized more for their ability to entertain in camp than to be relied upon on the pitch. I guess that’s what I’m trying to get at: being concerned about keeping people’s spirits up when you are there to be professional, do a job and earn glory for your country seems like not a winner’s mindset.
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Post by texan on May 26, 2021 9:19:26 GMT
I guess that’s what I’m trying to get at: being concerned about keeping people’s spirits up when you are there to be professional, do a job and earn glory for your country seems like not a winner’s mindset. On the contrary, I'd suggest that's the epitome of a winner's mindset. Leave no stone unturned in the quest for glory, from the training & tactics to the player's mental wellbeing and harmony. The culture of a side or club is where it all starts, there's a story today detailing how the first thing OGS did on his return to United was change that dynamic, change the feel of the training ground, who the players interacted with, who they sat with to eat in the canteen etc in an attempt to make a more upbeat atmosphere. Ther's also decades of evidence suggesting that downtime is one of the primary concerns of national sides at tournaments. How many times over the years have we had to read about England's players being 'bored' or unstimulated in between matches, other sides (France in South Africa if I recall) alluded to having too much time to be in their own heads & worrying about things ('hel meddyliau' in Welsh) and that translating itself onto the pitch accompanied by a general malaise & discontent in camp. In 2016 Wales evidently got it perfect. Having a contented, confident & occupied squad is an enormous part of nurturing that winning mentality. Without it you'd only have a talented set of individuals, which never goes far. So I'd suggest that (as long as they're fairly handy if called upon to play) having a couple of players in the squad to maintain/generate dressing room harmony & unity is not a far-fetched situation at all.
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Post by quetzal on May 31, 2021 17:47:16 GMT
He must have really f**ked up not to even get in the training camp. I wasn’t to keen on Hal but I think he was a plan b option off the bench. I’m sh*ting myself now.
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Post by dragonsoccer on Jun 1, 2021 11:19:34 GMT
Rob Page media session - Hal Robson-Kanu left out for football reasons
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Post by dragonsoccer on Jun 1, 2021 11:24:46 GMT
also just said - nothing to do with March
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Post by dai on Jun 1, 2021 11:36:04 GMT
Well, I would take that with a pinch of salt. I think Hal acted incredibly foolishly in March for a senior player, but you can't argue that he is a genuine match winner - Scotland away, Cyprus home, Slovakia in Euro16, arguably the decisive goal against Belgium in Euro16 etc.
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Post by aberbeeg on Jun 1, 2021 12:14:41 GMT
Firstly HRK is a very average footballer even more so now that Father Time has caught up with him.
Secondly he turned his back on Wales and retired when it suited him.
Thirdly his idiotic behaviour for a senior player left him wide open to not being trusted within camp.
I don’t think he can have any complaints. Time to move on.
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Post by marsvolta on Jun 1, 2021 13:53:12 GMT
Firstly HRK is a very average footballer even more so now that Father Time has caught up with him. Secondly he turned his back on Wales and retired when it suited him. Thirdly his idiotic behaviour for a senior player left him wide open to not being trusted within camp. I don’t think he can have any complaints. Time to move on. Add to that the fact that we went on a long unbeaten run without him and no one was worried about his absence. Plus the fact that he didn’t pull up many trees in the few games he came back for.
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Post by dragonsoccer on Jun 1, 2021 16:46:00 GMT
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Post by allezlesrouges on Jun 1, 2021 18:05:41 GMT
Firstly HRK is a very average footballer even more so now that Father Time has caught up with him. Secondly he turned his back on Wales and retired when it suited him. Thirdly his idiotic behaviour for a senior player left him wide open to not being trusted within camp. I don’t think he can have any complaints. Time to move on. To be fair to Hal he retired for personal/family related reasons initially
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Post by jbt95 on Jun 1, 2021 18:09:00 GMT
Colwill was not in the squad a month ago.
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Post by dragonsoccer on Jun 1, 2021 20:09:18 GMT
the message i posted was with reference to HRK
bit of background of the process for the training camp squads
EPL players were told of their inclusion in the last week of April, for the Portugal camp, this behind the scenes of course, as is now known HRK was not selected for this
Other players were told of their call ups for the Cardiff EFL camp/U21 just afterwards in early May, Taylor/Broadhead/Colwill/Smith/Moore etc
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Post by melynwy on Jun 1, 2021 20:17:04 GMT
Firstly HRK is a very average footballer even more so now that Father Time has caught up with him. Secondly he turned his back on Wales and retired when it suited him. Thirdly his idiotic behaviour for a senior player left him wide open to not being trusted within camp. I don’t think he can have any complaints. Time to move on. Add to that the fact that we went on a long unbeaten run without him and no one was worried about his absence. Plus the fact that he didn’t pull up many trees in the few games he came back for. And counter all that with the fact that he scored the greatest goal in the history of football.
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