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Post by pclaude on Dec 11, 2022 9:57:10 GMT
You can't win a World Cup with Maguire, Stones, Shaw and Pickford in your back line. You just can't. One of the top teams will find them out, and tbh I think it will be France France won last night with inferior CBs and Giroud at 9. And they will probably win the whole thing |
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Post by pembroke on Dec 11, 2022 10:03:51 GMT
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Post by cymro on Dec 11, 2022 11:06:35 GMT
I echo these thoughts 😄 As I posted yesterday I think an England win yesterday could have propelled them onto big things, not just this tournament but going forward too. As it is they've failed once again against a top team in a tournament and the uncertainty continues. Happy days. |
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Post by 1gwaunview on Dec 11, 2022 11:25:24 GMT
And Relax!!! Thank goodness.  |
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Post by erasedcitizen on Dec 11, 2022 11:33:13 GMT
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Post by allezlesrouges on Dec 11, 2022 12:25:49 GMT
You can't win a World Cup with Maguire, Stones, Shaw and Pickford in your back line. You just can't. One of the top teams will find them out, and tbh I think it will be France France won last night with inferior CBs and Giroud at 9. And they will probably win the whole thing France had by far the better CBs? And Giroud is world class so I'm not sure what you're getting at |
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Post by conwy10 on Dec 11, 2022 12:27:29 GMT
I echo these thoughts 😄 As I posted yesterday I think an England win yesterday could have propelled them onto big things, not just this tournament but going forward too. As it is they've failed once again against a top team in a tournament and the uncertainty continues. Happy days. I don't think they have the mentality to win these tournaments. Countries have 16/17 year old kids moving to academies in different countries, different continents, in the UK we give out medals for finishing last. Ajax makes their kids play on concrete. |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Dec 11, 2022 12:29:56 GMT
People will back France to make the final again, but Morocco have been unbelievable defensively. Aside from an own goal vs Canada they've not conceded. Played Belgium, Croatia, Spain and Portugal too, no slouches. Wouldn't put it past them to make the final or even go all the way
I do still think it's written in the stars for Messi tho
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Post by CrackityJones on Dec 11, 2022 12:34:28 GMT
Hoping for an Argentina Morocco final, the two best fan bases I encountered out there that would make for a cracking atmosphere and plenty of drama on the pitch no doubt
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Post by dai on Dec 11, 2022 12:38:24 GMT
I echo these thoughts 😄 As I posted yesterday I think an England win yesterday could have propelled them onto big things, not just this tournament but going forward too. As it is they've failed once again against a top team in a tournament and the uncertainty continues. Happy days. I actually think its only a matter of time before they win one. However them winning this year would have been horrific when we just didnt turn up. At least we can watch the world cup in peace now. Ive never come across a nation with so little self awareness though. The constant barrage of how ‘we are the best team’, ‘other teams fear us’ and the self-massaging commentary is just nauseating. |
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Post by insertname on Dec 11, 2022 13:19:42 GMT
I echo these thoughts 😄 As I posted yesterday I think an England win yesterday could have propelled them onto big things, not just this tournament but going forward too. As it is they've failed once again against a top team in a tournament and the uncertainty continues. Happy days. I don't think they have the mentality to win these tournaments. Countries have 16/17 year old kids moving to academies in different countries, different continents, in the UK we give out medals for finishing last. Ajax makes their kids play on concrete. Ajax and the Dutch haven’t won an international trophy since time immemorial so I’d say they might want to try playing on grass… |
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Post by jimexotic on Dec 11, 2022 13:27:07 GMT
It's always funny when England go out because of how people react. I DJ'd last night for 7 and a half hours and during the football. After the game I had to cut the music for a speech, when I came back in with the music I played Three Lions (I'm living and working in Norwich by the way). People are singing along but a few emotional St George's cross lads start kicking off and trying to start on me. If that wasn't enough I followed it up with Vindaloo and the place erupts but still these lads wouldn't let it go, World In Motion calmed a couple of them but as I dropped Waka Waka another one offered me out. I love football, life ain't always empty  |
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Post by cymro on Dec 11, 2022 13:30:31 GMT
It's always a matter of time but the mentality kills them. The English media is surprisingly quite complimentary of how they played last night, to my surprise. My take was that even if Kane had buried the 2nd penalty, where were the goal scoring chances in open play going to come from. They never seem to have a response to how clinical these top teams are in turning half a chance into a goal, so if they were happy with that performance, long may it continue in my book. They still look a while away from being able to win these crunch games against top opponents, let alone having to do it 2 or 3 times on the bounce.
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Post by insertname on Dec 11, 2022 13:30:51 GMT
People will back France to make the final again, but Morocco have been unbelievable defensively. Aside from an own goal vs Canada they've not conceded. Played Belgium, Croatia, Spain and Portugal too, no slouches. Wouldn't put it past them to make the final or even go all the way I do still think it's written in the stars for Messi tho For all the talk about how bad we were to watch is it any better seeing sides like Morocco and Croatia with so many draws be so successful though? I’m torn because on the one hand being strong defensively and playing for penalties is the main tactic a lot of weaker teams employ to go as far as they can in the tournament…but watching defence vs attack doesn’t produce very entertaining matches, just a novel result. Spain Vs Morocco was dire and the game yesterday was slightly better but it was still clear for the last half hour that Portugal were not going to score. Just imagine Croatia Vs Morocco in the final 😩 They might as well just go straight to penalties and have done with it. |
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Post by rushy on Dec 11, 2022 13:38:41 GMT
France played right on the edge committing countless fouls, the only gripe I have with England winning a tournament would be the completely outrageous and unbearable media coverage , knighthoods and gongs for everyone who's anyone, with endless coverage for years to come, but in all honesty with the amount of choice available to them then they should be reaching finals, and even winning.
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Post by hooky on Dec 11, 2022 13:40:46 GMT
I watched the last 60 mins of that last night and being cold and honest about it that was a massive missed opportunity for them
They were the better team. They should have had a penalty in the first half (watching the highlight of that) and Saka was fouled twice before they scored their first. The two penalties they did get were the correct calls - such stupid decisions by the French defenders.
It does not mean they would have won but France were a shambles defensively and Saka was frightening their defenders.
Granted even if they won it does not mean they would have won the tournament but they would have been favourites.
Its like us. One day it will happen for them and the bad luck stories will be confined to the past and then they can compete without the emotional baggage. Now they are producing fantastic, technically gifted players, which by the way is beneficial for us as the club academies are producing them, they will continue to produce teams that can stand toe to toe with the best teams one would assume.
We should stop enjoying their misfortune and focus on why we were so limp and ensure we never give such a bad account of ourselves again.
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Post by jimexotic on Dec 11, 2022 13:42:55 GMT
People will back France to make the final again, but Morocco have been unbelievable defensively. Aside from an own goal vs Canada they've not conceded. Played Belgium, Croatia, Spain and Portugal too, no slouches. Wouldn't put it past them to make the final or even go all the way I do still think it's written in the stars for Messi tho For all the talk about how bad we were to watch is it any better seeing sides like Morocco and Croatia with so many draws be so successful though? I’m torn because on the one hand being strong defensively and playing for penalties is the main tactic a lot of weaker teams employ to go as far as they can in the tournament…but watching defence vs attack doesn’t produce very entertaining matches, just a novel result. Spain Vs Morocco was dire and the game yesterday was slightly better but it was still clear for the last half hour that Portugal were not going to score. Just imagine Croatia Vs Morocco in the final 😩 They might as well just go straight to penalties and have done with it. I get what you're saying but I love watching good defending, I'm very OCD about it to the point where it ruined playing football for me! |
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Post by insertname on Dec 11, 2022 13:46:01 GMT
I echo these thoughts 😄 As I posted yesterday I think an England win yesterday could have propelled them onto big things, not just this tournament but going forward too. As it is they've failed once again against a top team in a tournament and the uncertainty continues. Happy days. I actually think its only a matter of time before they win one. However them winning this year would have been horrific when we just didnt turn up. At least we can watch the world cup in peace now. Ive never come across a nation with so little self awareness though. The constant barrage of how ‘we are the best team’, ‘other teams fear us’ and the self-massaging commentary is just nauseating. I can see how it looks that they’ll win something and it’s inevitable. Lineker himself said as much. But as Belgium can tell you there are no guarantees and as we have seen in this World Cup there are small teams who are very well drilled in the art of taking games to penalties that will knock you out if you don’t have the answers and teams like that, along with all the other fine margins that go into deciding tournaments means that it’s absolutely not a given at all that this generation will win something. Far more likely that they will continue to lose in semi-finals on fine margins. He was braver last night, Southgate, and from a neutral point of view I’m sad for him that his attempt to be braver in his selections (that plenty of us previously criticised him for) wasn’t rewarded…but overall I do think that England could do better without him. He’s just too wedded to his favourites. Why bring on Sterling? Rashford is in great form and yet gets 5 minutes at the end. Decisions like that will hold England back |
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Post by insertname on Dec 11, 2022 13:51:39 GMT
For all the talk about how bad we were to watch is it any better seeing sides like Morocco and Croatia with so many draws be so successful though? I’m torn because on the one hand being strong defensively and playing for penalties is the main tactic a lot of weaker teams employ to go as far as they can in the tournament…but watching defence vs attack doesn’t produce very entertaining matches, just a novel result. Spain Vs Morocco was dire and the game yesterday was slightly better but it was still clear for the last half hour that Portugal were not going to score. Just imagine Croatia Vs Morocco in the final 😩 They might as well just go straight to penalties and have done with it. I get what you're saying but I love watching good defending, I'm very OCD about it to the point where it ruined playing football for me! Yeah I guess there is a danger of thinking that everyone wants to just see goals scored, when there are some who can get a lot out of a tactical battle at 0-0. I’ve just started getting into American Football and, as a game, it beats football (and most other sports) hands down for drama because the way the scoring works there is far more ebb and flow to a game, so teams will routinely have to come from behind to win and the lead will change hands often. This World Cup has highlighted a real lack of that ebb and flow to me because scoring is so hard it naturally leads to risk averse behaviour, especially in knock out rounds. So for me I feel like the format needs to give more encouragement to scoring goals. Look at Argentina 2 Netherlands 2, the stand out 1/4 final for the neutral and far more dramatic and enjoyable a spectacle than either of Moroccos two knockout games. |
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Post by insertname on Dec 11, 2022 13:58:47 GMT
England are forgetting that their first goal against Wales was the result of a dive by Foden that the ref fell for. The BBC pointed it out at half time but none of their fans have held their hands up to it so they need to be very careful when banging on about how far back VAR should check for fouls etc. As with the Lampard non-goal in the 2010 World Cup which heralded goal line technology innovation in the game only seems to happen when it goes against England and they complain loudest about getting it changed. When they benefit from it there is no admission of fortune, the narrative is simply that England were just the better team.
So I’ve no sympathy and give them no credit for the penalty calls that they didn’t get having seen them benefit from bad ref calls previously in the tournament.
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Post by allezlesrouges on Dec 11, 2022 14:49:37 GMT
People will back France to make the final again, but Morocco have been unbelievable defensively. Aside from an own goal vs Canada they've not conceded. Played Belgium, Croatia, Spain and Portugal too, no slouches. Wouldn't put it past them to make the final or even go all the way I do still think it's written in the stars for Messi tho For all the talk about how bad we were to watch is it any better seeing sides like Morocco and Croatia with so many draws be so successful though? I’m torn because on the one hand being strong defensively and playing for penalties is the main tactic a lot of weaker teams employ to go as far as they can in the tournament…but watching defence vs attack doesn’t produce very entertaining matches, just a novel result. Spain Vs Morocco was dire and the game yesterday was slightly better but it was still clear for the last half hour that Portugal were not going to score. Just imagine Croatia Vs Morocco in the final 😩 They might as well just go straight to penalties and have done with it. To be fair Morocco drew their opening game and then drew against Spain in the last 16 but have won every other game in 90 mins. That's not really a lot of draws |
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Post by allezlesrouges on Dec 11, 2022 15:20:35 GMT
I get what you're saying but I love watching good defending, I'm very OCD about it to the point where it ruined playing football for me! Yeah I guess there is a danger of thinking that everyone wants to just see goals scored, when there are some who can get a lot out of a tactical battle at 0-0. I’ve just started getting into American Football and, as a game, it beats football (and most other sports) hands down for drama because the way the scoring works there is far more ebb and flow to a game, so teams will routinely have to come from behind to win and the lead will change hands often. This World Cup has highlighted a real lack of that ebb and flow to me because scoring is so hard it naturally leads to risk averse behaviour, especially in knock out rounds. So for me I feel like the format needs to give more encouragement to scoring goals. Look at Argentina 2 Netherlands 2, the stand out 1/4 final for the neutral and far more dramatic and enjoyable a spectacle than either of Moroccos two knockout games. If all you like from football is goals then I get that, but for me I enjoy watching tactical battled and technique and skills I find American football to be a stop-start snooze fest personally |
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Post by insertname on Dec 11, 2022 15:23:19 GMT
For all the talk about how bad we were to watch is it any better seeing sides like Morocco and Croatia with so many draws be so successful though? I’m torn because on the one hand being strong defensively and playing for penalties is the main tactic a lot of weaker teams employ to go as far as they can in the tournament…but watching defence vs attack doesn’t produce very entertaining matches, just a novel result. Spain Vs Morocco was dire and the game yesterday was slightly better but it was still clear for the last half hour that Portugal were not going to score. Just imagine Croatia Vs Morocco in the final 😩 They might as well just go straight to penalties and have done with it. To be fair Morocco drew their opening game and then drew against Spain in the last 16 but have won every other game in 90 mins. That's not really a lot of draws If they want to win the World Cup they’ll be adding some more draws. Can’t see them beating France or winning the final outright |
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Post by insertname on Dec 11, 2022 15:37:39 GMT
Yeah I guess there is a danger of thinking that everyone wants to just see goals scored, when there are some who can get a lot out of a tactical battle at 0-0. I’ve just started getting into American Football and, as a game, it beats football (and most other sports) hands down for drama because the way the scoring works there is far more ebb and flow to a game, so teams will routinely have to come from behind to win and the lead will change hands often. This World Cup has highlighted a real lack of that ebb and flow to me because scoring is so hard it naturally leads to risk averse behaviour, especially in knock out rounds. So for me I feel like the format needs to give more encouragement to scoring goals. Look at Argentina 2 Netherlands 2, the stand out 1/4 final for the neutral and far more dramatic and enjoyable a spectacle than either of Moroccos two knockout games. If all you like from football is goals then I get that, but for me I enjoy watching tactical battled and technique and skills I find American football to be a stop-start snooze fest personally I think you have to look past the stop start nature (which I appreciate for some used to the fluidity of football is hard to do) because underneath it’s a highly volatile game which creates very memorable matches. It’s not uncommon at all for a team to be two scores down and 9/1 with the bookies to win to come back and win with the last play of the match. The footballing equivalent of 9/1 is say, Newcastle scoring two late goals to beat Brentford 2-1 which hardly ever happens because comebacks in football are so much less likely after a team has fallen behind. Certainly this World Cup, whilst it’s had shocks, has not had many memorable matches that have defined the tournament and the ones that are memorable are generally ones that involved comebacks. Does a good 0-0 really stick in the memory? Games like that might be interesting from a tactical viewpoint but I don’t know where people find the sporting drama in them as in a tournament setting usually drawing is not a bad thing so either side is not pushed to want to win the game and can even progress quite far off the back of low scoring draws. Edit: maybe I’m being unkind about the number of memorable games, as Japan had two comebacks, Saudi Arabia beating Argentina, Argentina v Netherlands…I think it’s more the number of 0-0s in 90 minutes at this tournament of which there have been a few and most where both teams have been trying not to lose because of how much difference losing a game in the group stages can ruin your chances. Especially losing the opening game. It’s been a slog to watch at times. More so than other world cups in recent times. |
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Post by pclaude on Dec 11, 2022 17:06:45 GMT
France won last night with inferior CBs and Giroud at 9. And they will probably win the whole thing France had by far the better CBs? And Giroud is world class so I'm not sure what you're getting at 4 years ago Varane was excellent. Hes now not. Upamecano isnt good. No. Maguire is shit, but plays ok for England. Stones is better than the other three. Giroud is not world class. Not by any stretch |
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Post by cymruramdcfc on Dec 11, 2022 20:21:00 GMT
If England got past France I believe they would have gone on to win it, France was lucky. The language when they was awarded second penalty wad disgraceful on me .... but the miss was even worse and laughter at slobber chop missing
Fank f@ck they out
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Post by cymruramdcfc on Dec 11, 2022 20:24:52 GMT
France played right on the edge committing countless fouls, the only gripe I have with England winning a tournament would be the completely outrageous and unbearable media coverage , knighthoods and gongs for everyone who's anyone, with endless coverage for years to come, but in all honesty with the amount of choice available to them then they should be reaching finals, and even winning. Agree its not the team winning... we just never hear the end of it for another 50nodd years You don't hear any other country go on so much about a win decades ago |
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Post by jimexotic on Dec 11, 2022 21:05:33 GMT
Let's be honest, we do tend to go on about the 58 team quite a lot but it's nothing like what England do with anything they do remotely well in and it's a completely different kettle of fish with us, that's the best we've ever had and best we're ever likely to have for the forseeable. I am slightly concerned that we'll Euro 2016 will get done to death though, we need to move on from that, use it as an inspiration but not something that hangs over us and defines us for the next 30 years.
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Post by fiveattheback on Dec 11, 2022 21:17:37 GMT
Do we? I'd say we go on a bit too much about 2016, not 1958
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Post by conwy10 on Dec 11, 2022 21:21:55 GMT
I don't think they have the mentality to win these tournaments. Countries have 16/17 year old kids moving to academies in different countries, different continents, in the UK we give out medals for finishing last. Ajax makes their kids play on concrete. Ajax and the Dutch haven’t won an international trophy since time immemorial so I’d say they might want to try playing on grass… Outside the top 3 their league is on the equivalent of League One. They've got a massive amount of their academy in the national team. |
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