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Post by dai on Nov 29, 2016 22:22:35 GMT
Just turned on the radio earlier after coming home, and hearing Woodburn's name on the scoresheet has absolutely made my night! Superb!
I think we need to stop being paranoid about England etc. Without trying to downplay his achievements tonight, as I think it's amazing, but fact is, England have dozens of young players playing at a similar level to Woodburn, are they really going to be that bothered?
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Post by gwelfryn04 on Nov 29, 2016 22:25:11 GMT
I have only got really excited by 2 players over the last 2 decades - Bale and Ramsey. Why - because at a very early age they demonstrated a high skill level, and total confidence in their ability no matter their environment. Every game they would do something - be it a goal, create a chance, a great bit of skill. I feel the same way about what I have seen of Ben. He will definitely be a good premiership players if he stays injury free but will he be a consistently great player? Unfortunately England are not stupid. Ben's agent will be telling him how much more marketable he will be as an England international. I assume it will all come down to how Welsh his family feel. Does anyone know the details if his background/circumstances. Shame we didn't cap him instead of Wilson! Two things we have going for us - we have made a major impact on a tournament and we have 2 world class players. These can hopefully be used as a big draw. It would be a bonus if we could turnaround our world cup campaign and entice him with the opportunity of appearing in such a tournament Lets hope!. As someone who lives in north east Wales if I'd have had to move over the border, and had a child born in Chester, then no money in the world would make me let him play for England.... let's hope mr&mrs woodburn feel the same |
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Post by manulike on Nov 29, 2016 22:30:32 GMT
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Post by dai on Nov 29, 2016 22:32:32 GMT
I have only got really excited by 2 players over the last 2 decades - Bale and Ramsey. Why - because at a very early age they demonstrated a high skill level, and total confidence in their ability no matter their environment. Every game they would do something - be it a goal, create a chance, a great bit of skill. I feel the same way about what I have seen of Ben. He will definitely be a good premiership players if he stays injury free but will he be a consistently great player? Unfortunately England are not stupid. Ben's agent will be telling him how much more marketable he will be as an England international. I assume it will all come down to how Welsh his family feel. Does anyone know the details if his background/circumstances. Shame we didn't cap him instead of Wilson! Two things we have going for us - we have made a major impact on a tournament and we have 2 world class players. These can hopefully be used as a big draw. It would be a bonus if we could turnaround our world cup campaign and entice him with the opportunity of appearing in such a tournament Lets hope!. As someone who lives in north east Wales if I'd have had to move over the border, and had a child born in Chester, then no money in the world would make me let him play for England.... let's hope mr&mrs woodburn feel the same So his parents are both Welsh? I'm sure that settles this debate then. |
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Post by quetzal on Nov 29, 2016 22:35:44 GMT
Get him in the full squad. Bring him on last minute against Moldova Told you so!!! |
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Post by manulike on Nov 29, 2016 22:39:18 GMT
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Post by onceinalifetime on Nov 29, 2016 22:44:41 GMT
Has to be in the next squad, just has to be.
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Post by larslagerback on Nov 29, 2016 23:03:55 GMT
Interesting that he came on for Liverpool's defensive midfielder but scored from close range.
I wasn't watching properly as had work to do so can anyone tell me if he played in an advanced role or left of a midfield 3?
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Post by manulike on Nov 29, 2016 23:04:05 GMT
Has to be in the next squad, just has to be. I can imagine the FAW holding Ben back in the u-19 in the same way that Ramsey was kept back (while we still had a great chance to beat ENG and qualify for U21 Championship). The next big tournament is going to be in Toulon in late May - might be interesting, as ENG are the current holders! |
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Post by fireboy0610 on Nov 29, 2016 23:04:09 GMT
Ateotd it's purely upto him which country he wants to play for
BUT uptil now he's played for wales,he has showed his obvious passion for wales,his mam and dad are welsh and atm even though it shouldnt make a blind bit if difference we are doing very well so it's a no brainer for me
The powerful Welsh blood flowing through his veins will obviously tell him to promptly f@ck the english off
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Post by robin1864 on Nov 29, 2016 23:22:17 GMT
Now we can rave about him, although remaining a bit cautious, it's worth remembering the English gave this treatment to Walcott.
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Post by biwmares on Nov 29, 2016 23:29:47 GMT
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Post by hookd on Nov 29, 2016 23:30:16 GMT
Are his mum and dad Welsh? I though it was a grandparent? Or were his parents subject to the borders maternity hospital issue and were born the other side of the border but were Welsh through and through?
Just hope he keeps well away from Michael Owen!
To be fair I do not thing we have ever actually lost a talented youngster who played for us regularly through the age grades have we? In the case of Heargreaves didn't the FAW stupidly lose track of him? The likes of Owen, Rob Jones, etc, were never integrated into our system were they? The only one I can think of is ironically that Lloyd Jones of Liverpool and where is he now!
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Post by erasedcitizen on Nov 29, 2016 23:31:16 GMT
Now we can rave about him, although remaining a bit cautious, it's worth remembering the English gave this treatment to Walcott. Walcott would be one of our best players! |
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Post by hookd on Nov 29, 2016 23:32:36 GMT
Now we can rave about him, although remaining a bit cautious, it's worth remembering the English gave this treatment to Walcott. Walcott was and is a one trick pony whose key asset was pace. Players like Woodburn, Ramsey and Bale have several skill sets and are well rounded players able to play several different roles. |
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Post by erasedcitizen on Nov 29, 2016 23:34:10 GMT
Are his mum and dad Welsh? I though it was a grandparent? Or were his parents subject to the borders maternity hospital issue and were born the other side of the border but were Welsh through and through? He went to school in England so it isn't that. I've also heard that his parents are Welsh however and if this is the case, we should be alright. I wouldn't take the chance personally, 23 is a massive squad to have for 1 game, if we find ourselves in a glorious position of being 2 or more up in Ireland approaching the end of the game we could cap him to seal the deal. I'd rather him than Shaun Macdonald. |
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Post by manulike on Nov 29, 2016 23:36:56 GMT
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Post by mrpicton79 on Nov 29, 2016 23:43:02 GMT
Has to be in the next squad, just has to be. I can imagine the FAW holding Ben back in the u-19 in the same way that Ramsey was kept back (while we still had a great chance to beat ENG and qualify for U21 Championship). The next big tournament is going to be in Toulon in late May - might be interesting, as ENG are the current holders! Don't think Ramsey even qualified for England. No value at all in holding Ben back now. Assuming he still wants to play for us we have to cap him next possible opportunity, simple as that. The reality is very few players look as good as he does at 17. England's next competitive fixture is a home game against Lithuania in a mickey mouse qualifying group. Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if they offer him a place in the squad just to snap him up. Let's get in there first. |
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Post by manulike on Nov 29, 2016 23:46:16 GMT
Speaking at a news conference after the Leeds game, the Reds boss was pleased with Woodburn's overall performance on the night, but had concerns that the media would build up the youngster too much.
"We know what Ben is capable of and what he is already able to do," Klopp said. "My first job is to help these boys so that they can be the best.
"In this case, Ben Woodburn. There's a lot of things to do, especially to keep the public away as long as possible. That's quite a difficult thing to do. But on the other hand, we only bring him in because we want to use him. So that means when he's on the pitch he's absolutely allowed to score goals, to prepare situations, to make crosses -- how Trent [Alexander-Arnold] did, for example.
"So, all good. I'm really happy for him. The only problem is I'm a little bit afraid about you [the media]. That why I'm so quiet on this. Think and do what you want, but don't write anything -- only 'Goalscorer, Ben Woodburn.' Done. Quite a challenge!
"I don't think it makes sense that I say the obvious things. So first of all, I said 'Well done, but it was not too difficult! I would have scored too if I would have been in the situation!' That's maybe the truth. All good.
"Nothing we say here is important enough that it would help Ben Woodburn or myself. It's all good. We know how to handle the situation and I know I can say to you whatever I want, [but] if he scores goals then it's quite difficult to stay cool from your side. No problem.
"Tonight it was very important that we could have him on the bench and could bring him into the game, because of our situation in the offensive department. [He was] a very important player for us today and he scored a goal, which makes it more enjoyable."
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Post by biwmares on Nov 29, 2016 23:52:54 GMT
Lets hope he chooses to play for Wales & looking at his twitter page he will.
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Post by manulike on Nov 29, 2016 23:57:49 GMT
At the end of the day, its his choice.
If he is as intelligent as what he is made out to be, he should realise that in the England set-up there are at least TEN strikers or offensive midfielders, already. There is certainly no shortage of talent in that department for them. In the Welsh squad, well ... We have Sam, Hal and Simon ;-)
If he doesn't fancy his chances with that lot, or he doesn't feel Welsh enough ... that is fine by me!
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Post by mrpicton79 on Nov 30, 2016 0:00:08 GMT
Are his mum and dad Welsh? I though it was a grandparent? Or were his parents subject to the borders maternity hospital issue and were born the other side of the border but were Welsh through and through? Just hope he keeps well away from Michael Owen! To be fair I do not thing we have ever actually lost a talented youngster who played for us regularly through the age grades have we? In the case of Heargreaves didn't the FAW stupidly lose track of him? The likes of Owen, Rob Jones, etc, were never integrated into our system were they? The only one I can think of is ironically that Lloyd Jones of Liverpool and where is he now! It's weird, I had this memory of Michael Owen playing at some age grade level for Wales then switching to England later on but that's bollocks he only ever wore the England jersey en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Owen feeling better about our chances with Ben now. |
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Post by manulike on Nov 30, 2016 0:05:37 GMT
Are his mum and dad Welsh? I though it was a grandparent? Or were his parents subject to the borders maternity hospital issue and were born the other side of the border but were Welsh through and through? Just hope he keeps well away from Michael Owen! To be fair I do not thing we have ever actually lost a talented youngster who played for us regularly through the age grades have we? In the case of Heargreaves didn't the FAW stupidly lose track of him? The likes of Owen, Rob Jones, etc, were never integrated into our system were they? The only one I can think of is ironically that Lloyd Jones of Liverpool and where is he now! It's weird, I had this memory of Michael Owen playing at some age grade level for Wales then switching to England later on but that's bollocks he only ever wore the England jersey en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Owen feeling better about our chances with Ben now. pretty sure he lived in North Wales with his family and played for us at School level up until under 16 level www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/england/2388090/Owen-adamant-England-is-the-land-of-his-fathers.html |
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Post by dlwilliams on Nov 30, 2016 0:08:16 GMT
Tom Lawrence did get on the pitch for MUFC by the way ! I believe that was in a dead rubber at the end of the season when Giggs was in charge and playing all the youth available as some kind of charm offensive to the OT top brass. Whilst Woodburn didn't get a touch I really doubt someone like Klopp would put him on even for one minute if he didn't think he had some form of future at a high standard. This wasn't an end of season fixture to go through the motions. I am also usually the first to keep realities in check regarding over-hyped youth, but I think we can read very positive things into this. More concerning is Wilson. Really not sure about him. He did: www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9XIFVZmQMIHe got at least two touches. |
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Post by llannerch on Nov 30, 2016 0:12:57 GMT
The likes of Owen, Rob Jones, etc, were never integrated into our system In Owen's case that's because he's English. Was never eligible for Wales other than the Schools team. Jones was Ellesmere Port raised. His grandfather was and England international |
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Post by robin1864 on Nov 30, 2016 2:06:35 GMT
Now we can rave about him, although remaining a bit cautious, it's worth remembering the English gave this treatment to Walcott. Walcott would be one of our best players! What a depressing thought! |
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Post by quetzal on Nov 30, 2016 2:54:51 GMT
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Post by londonironside on Nov 30, 2016 4:52:56 GMT
Could they not have found a bit of a noisier spot to do that interview? |
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Post by alarch on Nov 30, 2016 11:28:46 GMT
There's little point in getting desperate over getting Woodburn capped. For a start we may well not have a game until the ROI qualifier in March - a long way away. We certainly can't include him in the squad for that game just to get him capped, given how important the game is - he would need to be there on merit. A big selling point for the whole Welsh set up is how we handle the players - and a lot of credit has to go to the likes of Cledwyn Ashford in that respect. What we mustn't do is what Roy Evans is advocating: "You've got to jump on these players when they become available and you think they're going to be good enough." That sort of blatantly expolitative and self-interested approach should be off-putting for player and his advisors.
We've got to try and remain classy and whilst giving him every positive encouragement to stay with Wales have to be willing to let him go if that's what he decides is best for him at the end of the day. We need to exercise "soft power" when it comes to handling youngsters, and outsmart England, who I'm confident will behave (the English press if not the FA) in a venal self-interested way. The English are so often their own worst enemies - but they lack the wisdom and humility to see it.
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Post by manulike on Nov 30, 2016 12:57:50 GMT
Nice tweets from FAW (two days ago!) and Rushie
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