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Post by cadno on Nov 22, 2017 0:03:51 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2017 0:33:11 GMT
Cheers Cadno. From reading all that it sounds like he's got below par players compared to the rest of the league. Think the Sounders are still dominant in the Western conference. I need to watch more MLS. I do enjoy that wacky league.
I wonder if "head coach" is North American for manager? Or if it means the same as in Europe in that he might not have final say on player recruitment?
Good reads. Thanks.
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Post by cymroircarn on Nov 22, 2017 7:32:06 GMT
On the subject of Carl Robinson no one has yet said anything about his managerial philosophy. He ticks the Welsh, passionate and has a half-tick in the experienced box, but the rest is a big blank. "Counter-attacking, hardworking, and honest. Those are the philosophies that shine through on a Carl Robinson team." Vancouver averaged the least possession in the league. The ‘Caps found most of their success through counter-attack and set pieces – and their 5-0 victory over San Jose Earthquakes was a prime example. Vancouver had the third most attempted crosses in MLS with 431. "But Robinson played it safe, and his team never attempted to try to open it up against the Sounders, playing not to lose, instead of trying to win. The Welsh manager’s conservative tactics proved to be incredibly tone deaf, and he doubled down on that approach in the second leg in Seattle – although, to be fair, influential attackers Yordy Reyna and Cristian Techera weren’t at full strength and played with injuries. Still, when the stakes have been at their highest, Robinson has cowered in terms of his tactics and player selection. A new philosophy has to be adopted, a culture change within the Whitecaps organization must take place. Complacency can no longer be accepted. They can’t be afraid of losing. From top to bottom, there has to be a fearlessness every time the Whitecaps take to the pitch, an expectation that they are going to win every game they play." More tactical talk: www.impactmontreal.com/en/post/2017/05/29/10-things-vancouver-whitecaps-fcThanks for that. So like all football managers it is survival first, style of play second. I still like him, but think he’s one for the future and not now until he has experience in a better standard league. |
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Post by cadno on Nov 22, 2017 9:31:45 GMT
"Counter-attacking, hardworking, and honest. Those are the philosophies that shine through on a Carl Robinson team." Vancouver averaged the least possession in the league. The ‘Caps found most of their success through counter-attack and set pieces – and their 5-0 victory over San Jose Earthquakes was a prime example. Vancouver had the third most attempted crosses in MLS with 431. "But Robinson played it safe, and his team never attempted to try to open it up against the Sounders, playing not to lose, instead of trying to win. The Welsh manager’s conservative tactics proved to be incredibly tone deaf, and he doubled down on that approach in the second leg in Seattle – although, to be fair, influential attackers Yordy Reyna and Cristian Techera weren’t at full strength and played with injuries. Still, when the stakes have been at their highest, Robinson has cowered in terms of his tactics and player selection. A new philosophy has to be adopted, a culture change within the Whitecaps organization must take place. Complacency can no longer be accepted. They can’t be afraid of losing. From top to bottom, there has to be a fearlessness every time the Whitecaps take to the pitch, an expectation that they are going to win every game they play." More tactical talk: www.impactmontreal.com/en/post/2017/05/29/10-things-vancouver-whitecaps-fcThanks for that. So like all football managers it is survival first, style of play second. I still like him, but think he’s one for the future and not now until he has experience in a better standard league. I always thought that Cookie would stay on for the next campaign, and then Robinson would come in. I'll admit I think it might be a bit early for Robbo, but who should come in? I don't want this group of players to miss out on Euro 2020. Lars Lagerback for one campaign? Klinsmann? Marcel Koller? |
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Post by cymroircarn on Nov 22, 2017 10:02:30 GMT
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Post by welwyn on Nov 22, 2017 13:19:33 GMT
Thanks for that. So like all football managers it is survival first, style of play second. I still like him, but think he’s one for the future and not now until he has experience in a better standard league. I always thought that Cookie would stay on for the next campaign, and then Robinson would come in. I'll admit I think it might be a bit early for Robbo, but who should come in? I don't want this group of players to miss out on Euro 2020. Lars Lagerback for one campaign? Klinsmann? Marcel Koller? Koller is a possibilty. We can't afford to buy out Lagerback from Norway so that's a no go. Klinsmann? Living in LA is none negotiable for him. He even lived there when German manager so it's a no from me. |
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Post by Enganche on Nov 22, 2017 19:47:32 GMT
I always thought that Cookie would stay on for the next campaign, and then Robinson would come in. I'll admit I think it might be a bit early for Robbo, but who should come in? I don't want this group of players to miss out on Euro 2020. Lars Lagerback for one campaign? Klinsmann? Marcel Koller? Koller is a possibilty. We can't afford to buy out Lagerback from Norway so that's a no go. Klinsmann? Living in LA is none negotiable for him. He even lived there when German manager so it's a no from me. Koller is a good shout. Would love to see someone like Marcelo Bielsa in, who's not having a great time of it at Lille and may be available. No idea what our budget is however and I doubt he'd be cheap. |
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Post by saints19 on Nov 22, 2017 21:46:23 GMT
I don't buy that. He's signed several of our players for his clubs. Obviously he knows them and their strengths and weaknesses. Has it occurred to you that maybe a slightly more physically combative style might benefit us in some qualifying games? It probably would have done in the last campaign. There is no Wales style - there is only the best style for the job that needs to be done. Yeah but also, notice which players he has signed and how he has used them. James Chester at RB being a keynote example. I don't disagree we could do with a bit more nous in terms of defensively and especially set-pieces but I just don't think we have the players to play Pulis-ball as a whole. Robson-Kanu and Chester are hardly purely physical players. I disagree with the whole argument that Pulis has no technical nous. Look at the goals HRK has scored at club and international level - not a one trick pony. |
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Post by cadno on Nov 29, 2017 16:23:22 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2017 21:58:58 GMT
Just was about to post the same thing then saw that you had already Cadno. Usually odds changes come from news stories with these kind of bets, but that move has come from nowhere. He's 8-1 now. Bellamy's odds have lengthened a fraction. An Osian/Robinson combo would be my ideal personally. |
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Post by pendragon on Dec 6, 2017 13:47:31 GMT
Oooh.. I wonder where the odds have sprung from? A chance remark? Seeing as they're looking to appoint within the next few weeks, they might be looking to shortlist and interview soon..
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Post by leggybach on Dec 6, 2017 15:56:20 GMT
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Post by gwernybwch on Dec 16, 2017 10:58:18 GMT
According to the Times today, both Bale and Ramsey have contacted Carl Robinson encouraging him to apply for the Manager's job.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2017 14:17:24 GMT
According to the Times today, both Bale and Ramsey have contacted Carl Robinson encouraging him to apply for the Manager's job. Are you a Times subscriber? Any chance you could cut and paste the article on here? Regardless of what your politics is, The Times is a trustworthy broadsheet when it comes to this type of story. So this is pretty massive news I would say. I got this far from what google would let me see... "Gareth Bale and Aaron Ramsey want Carl Robinson, the Vancouver Whitecaps coach, to replace Chris Coleman as Wales manager. The Welsh internationals are understood to have contacted the former Wolverhampton Wanderers and Sunderland midfielder, urging him to apply to the Football Association of Wales, who ..." |
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Post by gwernybwch on Dec 16, 2017 14:44:38 GMT
Sorry not a Times subscriber, all that I could see was the same as you have quoted. I've also seen comments on it in the Spanish press. Not sure if it was the Spanish press just quoting the Times or it whether the Spanish press was the original source.
I'm not sure if it that massive news though. If I remember the last time "the players" or at least Aaron Ramsey was quoted as saying that they / he wanted Dutch Ray to be the next manager but the FAW took no notice of them.
To an outsider, Bale and Ramsey actively encouraging Robinson to apply seems a little strange. I wouldn't have thought that they would have had much contact with each other since Robinson retired from playing? I'm guessing that they felt that Robbo supported them during the days when they were coming into the senior team, he turned up in the dark days and that he has demonstrated that he understands the #togetherstronger ethos.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2017 15:04:37 GMT
Sorry not a Times subscriber, all that I could see was the same as you have quoted. I've also seen comments on it in the Spanish press. Not sure if it was the Spanish press just quoting the Times or it whether the Spanish press was the original source. I'm not sure if it that massive news though. If I remember the last time "the players" or at least Aaron Ramsey was quoted as saying that they / he wanted Dutch Ray to be the next manager but the FAW took no notice of them. To an outsider, Bale and Ramsey actively encouraging Robinson to apply seems a little strange. I wouldn't have thought that they would have had much contact with each other since Robinson retired from playing? I'm guessing that they felt that Robbo supported them during the days when they were coming into the senior team, he turned up in the dark days and that he has demonstrated that he understands the #togetherstronger ethos. Dutch Ray was not employable after his Machiavellian behaviour I thought, so I do feel that's not such a comparable situation. I thought his comments/actions following Speed's death to try and shoe-horn himself into the Welsh job rendered him as someone who couldn't be considered at all. I don't remember when Rambo's endorsement came in the timeline of events though I do seem to remember that Rambo did so. But if our two star players are making this play now, as mature and experienced pros, then I do personally consider that a massive statement. I know many fans might dismiss the opinions of players as insignificant, but I'd put forward the argument that they know more than all fans and pundits put together. Just my feelings there. I'm not backing the players just because they've opted for a candidate that I wanted anyway. I have been posting on here that the FAW should take up Ash on his consultation offer. I don't think the Rambo/Bale action is strange at all. It could be that they simply think that Robbo is head and shoulders the best candidate and that other names being considered could be, in their view, a disaster. Slight hyperbole from me on this last point. |
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Post by gwernybwch on Dec 16, 2017 15:50:38 GMT
@otto I didn't make my point regarding it being massive news very well.
In course when the two most senior players contact someone asking them to apply is massive news, just that I don't think that it will have much bearing on the outcome. Mr. Coca Cola will want someone like Giggs to bring in the sponsorship income, Abantanto and others will want someone 'newsworthy' like Giggs or Pulis. I know one of the FAW Council and he will have a permanent boner at the thought of just getting close to Giggs. In the 'decision making tree' it will be money, media and the FAW Council that will decide who gets the job. The preferences of the players will be a distance fourth.
I think that Robbo is a great candidate, but I can't understand why - based on the commonly assumed logic of the players - they have supported him?
We are lead to believe that a player that is one of the most decorated, has been an Assistant Manager at one of the biggest club in the World would gain automatic respect by the players. He was their idol after all. But instead they are plumping for someone that was a journeyman player, that is "only" managing in the MLS. He only scraped past 50 caps for Wales by coming on as a substitute and playing in friendlies.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2017 16:00:36 GMT
@otto I didn't make my point regarding it being massive news very well. In course when the two most senior players contact someone asking them to apply is massive news, just that I don't think that it will have much bearing on the outcome. Mr. Coca Cola will want someone like Giggs to bring in the sponsorship income, Abantanto and others will want someone 'newsworthy' like Giggs or Pulis. I know one of the FAW Council and he will have a permanent boner at the thought of just getting close to Giggs. In the 'decision making tree' it will be money, media and the FAW Council that will decide who gets the job. The preferences of the players will be a distance fourth. I think that Robbo is a great candidate, but I can't understand why - based on the commonly assumed logic of the players - they have supported him? We are lead to believe that a player that is one of the most decorated, has been an Assistant Manager at one of the biggest club in the World would gain automatic respect by the players. He was their idol after all. But instead they are plumping for someone that was a journeyman player, that is "only" managing in the MLS. He only scraped past 50 caps for Wales by coming on as a substitute and playing in friendlies. Great points on the media. I can't help thinking that three man shorlist article from WOL a couple of days ago was hyperbolic nonsense. Perhaps the players have had more contact with Robbo than we realise? Or perhaps he made a good impression as a player under Toshack? I can't answer that one to be honest... Just noticed your footer by the way. Outstanding. How can I join? |
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Post by marsvolta on Dec 16, 2017 16:03:26 GMT
@otto I didn't make my point regarding it being massive news very well. In course when the two most senior players contact someone asking them to apply is massive news, just that I don't think that it will have much bearing on the outcome. Mr. Coca Cola will want someone like Giggs to bring in the sponsorship income, Abantanto and others will want someone 'newsworthy' like Giggs or Pulis. I know one of the FAW Council and he will have a permanent boner at the thought of just getting close to Giggs. In the 'decision making tree' it will be money, media and the FAW Council that will decide who gets the job. The preferences of the players will be a distance fourth. I think that Robbo is a great candidate, but I can't understand why - based on the commonly assumed logic of the players - they have supported him? We are lead to believe that a player that is one of the most decorated, has been an Assistant Manager at one of the biggest club in the World would gain automatic respect by the players. He was their idol after all. But instead they are plumping for someone that was a journeyman player, that is "only" managing in the MLS. He only scraped past 50 caps for Wales by coming on as a substitute and playing in friendlies. Great points on the media. I can't help thinking that three man shorlist article from WOL a couple of days ago was hyperbolic nonsense. Perhaps the players have had more contact with Robbo than we realise? Or perhaps he made a good impression as a player under Toshack? I can't answer that one to be honest... Just noticed your footer by the way. Outstanding. How can I join? Yeah, they could still be in touch with Robinson even thou they aren't teammates anymore |
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Post by gwernybwch on Jan 2, 2018 22:32:49 GMT
Reports on Twitter that Carl Robinson and Osian Roberts were having a coffee together before the Swansea game tonight.
Can only imagine what the conversation was about "Got your new suit for your job interview next week?" "Yeah, you" "You doing your presentation on Powerpoint?" "Yeah, using Clipart and all sorts".
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Post by cymroda on Jan 2, 2018 23:36:28 GMT
Reports on Twitter that Carl Robinson and Osian Roberts were having a coffee together before the Swansea game tonight. Can only imagine what the conversation was about "Got your new suit for your job interview next week?" "Yeah, you" "You doing your presentation on Powerpoint?" "Yeah, using Clipart and all sorts". Yeah, they were. Saw them myself. Was wondering if they were discussing one being the assistant to the other? Wouldn't have thought it odd for just Roberts to be there considering Ben was playing for Spurs, but can't think it's a coincidence for them both to be together on a miserable night in Swansea. |
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Post by richierich333 on Jan 3, 2018 9:07:33 GMT
This guy for me. He has to be the favourite now, I might put a few quid on. The senior players want him which is huge. Bet this before he becomes odds on.
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Post by Albert on Jan 3, 2018 12:42:22 GMT
This guy for me. He has to be the favourite now, I might put a few quid on. The senior players want him which is huge. Bet this before he becomes odds on. Steady on there!! John Hartson expects Ryan Giggs to be next Wales manager - www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42548930 |
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Post by phillywelsh83 on Jan 3, 2018 12:47:48 GMT
Robinson? What planet are people on? Its like anyone but Giggs. I think I know who Brooks and Ampadu would be more excited by! Robinson is the serious link to Wales that actually has managerial experience, albeit out of the UK. He is well respected in the North America for the job hes done there and hes Welsh - so its not an unworldy suggestion. But im with you on the anyone but Giggs nonesense - they obviously dont care about Wales, as it should be whats best for Wales. |
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Post by richierich333 on Jan 3, 2018 13:20:14 GMT
Robinson? What planet are people on? Its like anyone but Giggs. I think I know who Brooks and Ampadu would be more excited by! Planet earth, he's 5/2. Also when did I say anyone but Giggs? Look through my posts I've been firmly on the fence with regards to Giggs. |
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Post by blackfish on Jan 3, 2018 13:25:06 GMT
Robinson? What planet are people on? Its like anyone but Giggs. I think I know who Brooks and Ampadu would be more excited by! Robinson is the serious link to Wales that actually has managerial experience, albeit out of the UK. He is well respected in the North America for the job hes done there and hes Welsh - so its not an unworldy suggestion. But im with you on the anyone but Giggs nonesense - they obviously dont care about Wales, as it should be whats best for Wales. Bullshit. Utter, utter bullshit. |
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Post by pendragon on Jan 3, 2018 13:46:42 GMT
Whatever one says about Robinson, he appears to at least be a dedicated, hardworking and experienced candidate. Rather on the fence regarding his appointment though but he's got to be among the best (along with Osian) of a relatively limited bunch.
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Post by zenith on Jan 3, 2018 18:27:58 GMT
A duo of Robinson and Roberts would suit me just fine
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Post by cadno on Jan 9, 2018 15:57:48 GMT
Please give Carl Robinson the job!
I've been reading Dave Edwards' book, it's brilliant and he talks about how passionate Cookie's team talks were, and how Coleman was able to connect with the players.
I really can't see Giggs or Bellamy having that kind of relationship with the players.
I can definitely see Robinson having huge passion and also being a good man manager.
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Post by phillywelsh83 on Jan 9, 2018 16:42:48 GMT
Please give Carl Robinson the job! I've been reading Dave Edwards' book, it's brilliant and he talks about how passionate Cookie's team talks were, and how Coleman was able to connect with the players. I really can't see Giggs or Bellamy having that kind of relationship with the players. I can definitely see Robinson having huge passion and also being a good man manager. Oh i think Bellamy would be very passionate about the job, and that would come across to the players. I also think Giggs would motivate them in a different way, they would be captivated by what he has to say about football, other than Bale, no one has the experience in that dressing room of reaching the pinnacle of world football. I like what Carl Robinson has done in the MLS, and he is well respected there, has the experience of managing, that with Giggs dividing the Red Wall, is why i would go with Carl Robinson. |
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